Ductwork and Shop Layout Revisited

[Scott Wigginton]

I've gained some new tools since I last asked about some shop layout advice, and now I'm ready to tackle the ductwork.

Shop Layout

The biggest score was a RAS which now sits where my CMS was gonna go. My main dilemma is whether to keep it crosscut only, crosscut & miters, or dado only. The more I think about the smaller projects I'm focused on the more I think a workflow using my jigsaw to rough cut will be more than sufficient. With that I could leave the RAS as dado and keep my CMS tucked in a corner and can take it outside with its folding stand if I ever need it.

I landed a stand up router table but with my shaper I think the main item I'll be doing with it is template routing curves, leaving me leaning toward swapping the cast-iron wing from the left to right side of my TS and making an extension like this (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showpost.php?p=1075884&postcount=4) for the left side.

The outfeed table/alternate assebly table is a section of bowling alley lane 6' long and 42" wide. Eventually I will rip it to replace two of my workbench tops and build something like the Ultimate Tool Stand, but for now it works great and is on two sawhorses that are loaded up with insulation.

Here's the shop layout, let me know what y'all think.

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Ductwork

Thanks to the shallow roof pitch and large rafters I am having a difficult time with my ductwork layout. The main issues are how to build a separator in the DC roof which has a low clearance roof and where to bring the duct through the wall.

Since the DC room is on the other side of what used to be exterior walls it shouldn't recirculate the air back into the shop (especially if I open that outside door), this way I can use a non-ideal separator instead of a cyclone which I do not have the clearance for. I have an 8" inlet to my DC so I'm thinking take that to the top of the separator and come out the other side with an 8-6-6 double wye to feed the two runs.

Another hurdle is the location of the jointer, if I want to keep the lumber wall clean I would have to go up over the rafter, to the corner of the shop, and back along the floor. This would add almost 30' to the run plus four extra 45deg elbows and make it difficult to access the blast gate.

This is why I am thinking of splitting the two runs in the DC room. The run to the Table Saw/Band Saw will angle to the ceiling and follow along and above the rafters, but the run toward the Jointer/RAS will come out just over my sheet rack at about 54", clear the sheet rack and turn downward with a drop for my Jointer, then hug the ground under my lumber rack to get to the back wall. It would partially interrupt my wall of lumber but I could keep longer boards above it and still fit 6' boards on either side of it.

Another question this leaves me with is should I keep both runs open at all times since they're fed off an 8" inlet, or should I put a blast gate to give me the option of removing the opposite leg from use?

Last question is about the planer, I've decided on an '80s Craftsman (by Belsaw) (http://www.owwm.com/photoindex/detail.aspx?id=5800) in near mint condition. I haven't picked it up yet to see if it has duct collection, but I can mod it within reason. Is there much gain to feeding the planer off the 6" flex that goes to the jointer, or can I use the 4" flex that typically will go to my SG/Extension Router wing and use that for my planing?

Here's the ductwork layout, hoping for some good feedback since I want to start this soon but don't want to get 80% done to realize a mistake in my design

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Thanks

-Scott

[Phil B]

Here are some thoughts:

1. I think your dc duct work dilemmas are secondary to efficient machine placement. You have a challenging space and need to maximize the efficiency of everything.

2. I would think long and hard before putting that RAS in there. Takes up a lot of room and duplicates in part what the tablesaw already does.

3. Likewise, I would think long and hard before putting that shaper in there. You can get by pretty good with the router table.

4. Switch to a combo jointer / planer (I like the jet). In such a small space, you will see a big benefit.

5. I didn’t see what size your DC is. If it’s 2hp or larger you could get away with a perimeter line, even 6” instead of that Y design and just drop down to the tool with 6 or 4”. If it isn’t 2hp then 6” pipe is probably too big.

6. I don’t see a drill press, pretty handy to have around.

7. Realistically, I don’t think you have room for a static assembly & finishing table. Free floor space is going to be at such a premium I think you need it to be as absolutely flexible as possible.

8. I can see why you put the workbench where you did in front of the window. If that hinders more efficient placement then it looks like the next best place would be over in the area by the other two windows.

PMB

[Scott Wigginton]

Phil, the shop has some difficult corners to work in. The right hand side area starts with a ceiling height of 7' 6" and is down to under 5' at the wall. The area with the assembly/finishing table is a raised area with one layer of bricks. The door by the wall is really a window where someone cut a door down to 3' x 3' and hung it on some hinges.

On to some of your specific points.

2) Right now it also stores as extra worksurface, :D I don't care for putting a dado blade on a TS which is why the RAS appeals to me for that use. Plus I'm hard pressed to find something else that better utilizes that wall (not long enough for jointer/planer/shaper) I've considered putting lumber on that wall as well or some tool cabinet/storage.

3) I already have the shaper with about 10 cutter profiles. I'm gonna be pressed to get a decent router plate, nevermind a lift or fence system

4) Not an option, just got my 8" Grizzly and that large planer is gonna be less than a used lunchbox

5) My DC is a 3 HP Powermatic. My issue with drops around the jointer is access to the blast gate and how it interferes with the lumber storage on that wall. From here I can't see a good perimeter setup that is not excessively long and I don't want to waste a bunch of CFM because of ductwork SP

6) Been trolling craigslist but funds are limited right now, probably will find a deal on a benchtop which can go about anywhere

[Ryan Stagg]

Hi Scott,

I agree with your sentiments regarding the RAS - I have a nice old Craftsman and wouldn't trade it for the world. There are no peers for dado work - I don't see how so many get by with sleds and routers. I have mine setup dado-only, with the slider right next to it. Really, to me it doesn't take up much more room than a decent 12" slider, and does a lot more.

What are the overall dimensions of your shop? Judging by your jointer, I was guessing around 14' from the workbench wall to the lumber rack wall? 'Looks like it's about the same dimensions as mine.

I won't comment on the DC piping, as I think you understand your constraints pretty well, and as long as it's blast-gated, I don't think you'll have problems given the power of your collector. Even with the perimeter setup you talked about, I think you'd probably have plenty of CFM.

One thing that bothers me is the TS setup - how will you accommodate ripping longer stock? Right now it looks like you can't rip anything longer than 4', and rolling it back will quickly run you into the BS. Do you have an easy way to reposition it and still use the DC?

[Lee Schierer]

I don't quite understand the layout of your ceiling so this suggestion may not be valid. I would change locations with the clamp rack and the radial arm saw or put the RAS on wheels. You will find that you need a longer work surface to the left and right of the saw than just the width of the table. The clamp location will give you more room for the RAS, the clamps can go in the corner and the shaper can be centered along the wall where it is drawn.