Resawing Long Lumber -Tutorial

[Bob Easton]

You "Creekers" have lots of answers and I constantly learn from you. This is an effort to return some information to the creek.

Some who follow my blog know of several posts about various aspects of resawing boat lumber. I've found various hand tool resawing techniques around the Internet, but they are usually for relatively short boards. My interest is in boat lumber, often as long as 16 feet and sometimes longer.

http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/resaw-with-bob-150x150.jpg (http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/resaw-with-bob.jpg)
Many hours sitting on the saw bench and a good stack of resawn lumber has brought me to the point where I can now pull my experience together as a tutorial. That's not to say I think myself expert, but only that I've learned enough to feel basically competent. There's more to learn before claiming real proficiency. This information will help those who want to resaw lengthy pieces of softwood lumber using hand tools. It may or my not help others. For example, I don't know how well these methods will work for tight grained hardwoods.

Click on any image, or visit the blog article (http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/?p=475), to see a larger version.

http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2008/08/cedar-flitch-150x150.jpg (http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2008/08/cedar-flitch.jpg)
So, why resaw by hand? First, the Atlantic white cedar I use for boat lumber is more than twice as thick as I need for planking and deck material. Slicing it doubles the value of each board. I'm a skinflint who likes to avoid buying more than I need. Second, my band saw is an entry level machine that would need significant investment to get the capacity and horsepower needed for lumber up to 12 inches wide. Third, I'm a skinflint Neanderthal galoot and would rather do it myself than pay the lumber mill. Fourth, this is a hobby, not a business where time might be more important. Fifth,my hand tools are powered by Snickers Bars (http://www.snickers.com/default.htm), and the more I use them, the more Snickers Bars I can work off.

In the next few entries, I'll tell you what I've learned about making and tuning a saw, about holding the work pieces, about prepping a work piece, and techniques for getting good results.

Before going on, I have to recognize and thank several people. THANKS to Bob Smalser for his saw straightening and rehab tutorials (http://www.wkfinetools.com/contrib/bSmalser/z_art/strSawBlade/strSawBlade1.asp) on the Sawmill Creek forums and elsewhere, to Junior Strasil, also on Sawmill Creek, for his work holding and saw filing suggestions (http://sawmillcreek.org/showpost.php?p=964609&postcount=21), to Peter Taran for his saw sharpening primer (http://www.vintagesaws.com/library/primer/sharp.html) on the Vintage Saws (http://www.vintagesaws.com/) site, to Josh Clark for his article (http://hyperkitten.com/woodworking/frame_saw.php3) on making a frame saw, and to many others who have added to discussions on the forums and in my blog comments. My success results largely from learning from these folks who graciously share their knowledge.

[Bob Easton]

THE SAW (http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/?p=271)
http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/frame-saw-1-150x150.jpg (http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/frame-saw-1.jpg)
My frame saw is made of oak almost exactly as Josh Clark described in his article (http://hyperkitten.com/woodworking/frame_saw.php3). His design has given me a frame that is very strong and easy to handle.

Since the post about building the saw, I am on the third blade. The first was a very nice blade about 1 3/4 inches wide and quite thin. I now know that it is a "peg tooth" design (Thanks to "Saint Roy" for that definition) and is not really optimal for rip cutting. It worked OK, but slowly. Next, I tried a 3/4 inch wide 3 TPI band saw blade. It cut much faster, but also went wildly astray just as fast. The current blade is 2 inches wide, cut from a 1915 era Disston D-8 rip saw.

One of Junior Strasil's suggestions was to file the saw teeth at 90 degrees instead of the usual 82 degrees (0 degrees of rake instead if 8 degrees of rake). This produces a more aggressive angle of attack and has worked very well. However, I had never ever sharpened a saw, and that meant learning how. I found Peter Taran's "Saw Filing - A Beginner's Primer (http://www.vintagesaws.com/library/primer/sharp.html)," an excellent guide. It suited my learning style. That old D-8, a few inexpensive tools, and some patience turned a reasonably decent saw into something I call "wicked sharp." For example, when using this blade for normal ripping of 4 quarters cedar, a gentle nudge and the weight of the saw cuts about an inch per stroke.

While refiling this blade, I removed most of the set. The first couple of feet of resawing proved to "sticky," so I added some set. Then (of course), it wanted to drift to one side, so I stoned that side. That first board has a good bit of "wandering" as I learned to tune the saw. That's OK. I need some really thin boards for decking.

The end lesson in all this rambling about the saw is that saw sharpening is not that difficult. I see it as a gateway skill that any hand tool woodworker should be able to easily learn. The next time your saw needs sharpening, don't send it out. Do some reading at Vintage Saws (http://www.vintagesaws.com), order some files and learn a new skill.

One last suggestion. When you make your own saw, be sure to give extra attention to making edges comfortable to hold. For this kind of work, your hands will spend lots of time at the upper reaches of the uprights, and at the outer ends of the top piece.

[Bob Easton]

WORKPIECE PREP

http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/big-board-long-bench-150x150.jpg (http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/big-board-long-bench.jpg)
The cedar I use is purchased as live edge flitches. Each board is rough sawn, about 4 quarters thick, and still has bark on the edges. For each flitch, I find the widest width of heartwood I can get from it and strike chalk lines for the waste that's to be removed. If the board is narrow enough to fit within the frame saw, I use it to rip to the lines, about 3 or 4 minutes work for each 16 foot edge. If the board is too wide for the frame saw, I put the board vertically on the front apron of my long workbench and rip with a bow saw. Depending on how careless I was sawing, a few minutes with a jack plane might be needed.

http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/edge-prep-150x150.jpg (http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/edge-prep.jpg)
The most important part of the prep is marking center lines on the edges. I use a center marking tool and scribe these lines about 3/16 inch deep and on all 4 edges. Yes, it is worth the effort to mark the ends (well, at least one end) as well as the long edges. These deep and easily visible scribe lines are critical to getting good results.

Lastly, I mark distances in one foot intervals on the long edges. It helps quiet the idle child's question, "Are we there yet?"

WORK HOLDING

This had me a bit puzzled until I asked a question on one of the Sawmill Creek forums. Junior Strasil replied with a lengthy answer (http://sawmillcreek.org/showpost.php?p=964609&postcount=21) that led to the solution I'm using now. I already had two very nice saw benches (http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/?p=173) that I built from plans by Chris Schwarz (http://blog.lostartpress.com/2008/02/17/Free+Construction+Drawings+For+The+2008+Sawbench.a spx). They were a matched pair, both the same height, an important part of the answer.
http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/resaw-bench-3-150x150.jpg (http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/resaw-bench-3.jpg)
I added two vertical guides to one of the benches. Those guides form a gate that holds a board vertical underneath the bench top. Wedges in the gate keep the board absolutely vertical. I originally used wedges under the boards to clamp the up against the bench top but have since changed to using a simple f-clamp instead. It's faster and easier to set. Recently, a wider board wouldn't fit, so I modified the cross braces of the larger saw bench to accommodate a notch for the wider board.

Wider boards also present another problem. There's reduced room for the length of the throw. In some pictures, you'll see the saw benched sitting atop 2 by 4s, offering a bit more throw.

The basic setup is using the bench with the gate at the end of the board being cut, and the other bench clamped to the other end of the board to keep the board relatively level. The two benches and me sitting on one of them is enough to keep the workpiece stable.

[Bob Easton]

SAWING

Start with the board extending 12-18 inches from the gate. Start the cut very carefully, using the scribe line on the top edge and the end to ensure as precise a start as possible. I have found several techniques useful in keeping the cut precise.

Watch the bottom of the cut with a hand mirror. Propping the mirror up at an angle helps keep it back from being directly under the cut and reduces the frequency you'll need to clear off the sawdust.

Vary the angle of attack frequently. Sawing with the bottom edge moving away produces a long leading ramp inside the kerf on the top edge of the board. Raking the saw over in the opposite direction produces a long leading ramp inside the kerf from the bottom edge of the plank.

http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/cut-top-ramp-150x150.jpg (http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/cut-top-ramp.jpg)

http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/cut-bottom-ramp-150x150.jpg (http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/cut-bottom-ramp.jpg)

Use the mirror for this one. When you're making a nice little curl directly from the center of the scribe line, the ramp is perfect.

http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/cut-perfect-150x150.jpg (http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/cut-perfect.jpg)

These ramps provide very effective guidance for the blade. Bring the blade vertical to saw away the apex of these two ramps.

http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/cut-normal-150x150.jpg (http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/cut-normal.jpg)

Changing the sawing angles is also helpful for removing dust. There is not enough throw in the saw strokes to efficiently remove dust. That is, the tooth that starts a stroke does not continue all the way through the board to release its dust. The most dust clogging happens when sawing the upper ramp. One method that helps remove this dust is to rock the saw in an arc, kicking up the bottom with each stroke. The other sawing angles are much better for releasing dust. It really falls out easily when the saw is cutting the bottom ramp and at angles approaching that one.

Changing these angles frequently does two things: the ramps provide guidance and the different angles of attack keep the sawing surface small and dust release effective. One might think that resawing a 10 inch wide board requires constantly sawing a 10 inch wide surface, just as a band saw does. I've tried it that way, and progress is much faster with the multiple angle approach.

Binding is a potential problem. The first few feet of every board produces the most pinch in the kerf. The boards want to pinch back together quite strongly until the cut moves in 3 to 4 feet. After the kerf becomes 3 or 4 feet long, tension eases and the kerf opens. Until then, thin wedges in the kerf can provide relief. It also helps to wax the saw occasionally. I use a simple candle for waxing.

Sawing effort is moderate, and should be kept moderate. Anytime a saw is forced, it's liable to bend away from the desired path. I have a few feet of lumber that proves that point well. When the saw is running smoothly in an open kerf and with good guidance ramps, it is easy to maintain a cadence of 60-70 strokes per minute without breathing heavily. Cutting rates depend on the width of the board. My cutting rate for an 8 inch board is almost 4 feet per hour. A 12 inch board drops to about half that. OK, OK, I hear you asking (again) if this guy's crazy. Probably! But he's working off those Snickers Bars.

[Bob Easton]

AS THE CUT PROGRESSES

We started the cut with a saw bench clamped to each end of the board. The gated bench starts, with the gate facing the end of the board, about 12-18 inches from the end of the board. As I sit on the end of the bench, I find 18 inches a comfortable reach. When the cut nears the bench, unclamp the gated bench and pull it back along the board another 12-18 inches. Recenter the board in the gate, Set the f-clamp at the tail of the bench and continue sawing. When the mid point of the board is reached, the cut ends of the boards are probably flapping around and maybe affecting the cut. That's when it's time to move the supporting bench from the tail end of the board to the other end.

Continue the process of periodically moving the gated bench until there's no room to use a clamp. At this point, unclamp everything and rearrange the benches and saw so that the gated bench now has the gate facing the short end of the board, and the saw is trapped between the gate and the end of the board. It is very uncomfortable to attempt cutting by sitting on the bench and pushing the saw backwards. Get a chair of similar height and sit at the end of the board to complete the cut. Since there's no body full of Snickers Bars sitting on either bench, some temporary weight or other constraint might be needed to keep the rig from moving. I sometimes toss a rope through the legs of the supporting bench and tie it to something immovable in the shop.

WHEN THE CUT GOES ASTRAY

http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/watch-the-mirror-150x150.jpg (http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/watch-the-mirror.jpg)
Oh, it will. This was a frequent occurrence on my first few boards. Saw tuning, and developing the multi-angle techniques have mostly eliminated the problems, but you need to know how to recover. Of course, constant use of the mirror helps spot the wandering before it gets serious. I used to keep the mirror on the bench beside me, and reach for it once in a while. After a few wanderings, I learned to keep the mirror on the floor and to watch it constantly. OK, back to recovery. Imagine that you've wandered off into day dreaming as you saw and the saw has wandered off too. You'll see this at the bottom of the cut, not the top. (probability = 1.0) The best recovery I've found is to unclamp the workpiece and turn it over. Work at correcting the wandering from the top. Be forewarned that simply trying to use brute force to press the end of the saw back to the line will result in a nice long cupped section. Don't ask how I know.


NEXT?

Some of the blog commenters have wondered whether a saw with fewer teeth per inch would cut faster. That's very likely. A 3 tpi saw with deeper gullets might be faster. I don't yet know. I'm at 5 tpi because that was the original filing of that old D-8 blade and it was an experiment, one that turned out quite well. I might get another old rip saw and try a 3 tpi, deep gullet version. For the time being, there's a lot of thin spruce pieces needing ripping and I want to keep this 5 tpi blade for that work.

If there's anyone reading this who also thinks resawing with hand tools is a good idea, leave a comment. I'd love to know there are other skinflint Neanderthal galoots around. What fuels your hand tools?

[Steve Pirrelli]

Great thread! Not sure I'll ever tackle it but I love seeing what some can do with just handtools.

[Robert Rozaieski]

FANTASTIC Bob! Thanks a lot for putting this together!

FWIW your experience with the bandsaw blade in your frame saw is the exact reason I gave up trying to resaw with my old shop made frame saw. Bandsaw blades simply aren't made for sawing by hand. The tooth geometry just isn't right. I do very little resawing so I never fixed my old frame saw, rather I just use a rip filed hand saw. I've considered picking up another to refile with a coarser pitch (current saw is 5.5 TPI) to dedicate just for this purpose. I've no problem using my regular rip saw since it's filed correctly for hand sawing. In my experience, the saw blade is likely the reason a lot of folks find resawing by hand challenging, regardless of the stock length. The common advice to cut up a band saw blade for a frame saw I think is all wrong and it sounds like you found that out yourself too.

Love the solution for holding the boards too. Do you ever flip your stock around while sawing or do you do all your sawing from one edge and one end? I find sawing from opposite ends and meeting in the middle of the board helpful because I use my bench vise to hold my stock but I don't typically saw from all four corners as is sometimes suggested.

Again, thanks for taking the time to put this excellent tutorial together. Like you I've found that it really isn't all that hard to resaw by hand when you have the right tool for the job ;).

So when do we get to see one of those boats? :D (I'm a sucker for a wooden boat)

[David Keller NC]

Very Nice tutorial, Bob, and very useful. I've been trying to puzzle out how to make and use the equivalent of a pit saw without the necessity of finding a helper (as you might imagine, they're aren't too many volunteers for this kind of work!). Your frame saw maight be a good alternative, though I don't think I can bring myself to cut up a 1915 Disston...

So - Curious. You state that your rate on an 8" wide board is about 4 feet per hour. Given that you're resawing soft cedar and that you mention 60-80 strokes a minute, that seems quite slow. Is that a mis-print, or is 4 feet an hour including lots of snicker's bars breaks?

[Mark Roderick]

Great thread, Bob. An internet user forum at its best.

[Michael Sobik]

Holy smokes, that's awesome. You are a maniac. Thanks for all the great info. Nice bench, btw.

[Zahid Naqvi]

Great post Bob, this one goes in the FAQs.
Although I don't know if I will tackle something like this on my own. Despite the suggestions of Robert that one can resaw using a regular rip saw

[Jim Koepke]

Great post, glad to see it going into the FAQs.

Not sure if the linked images will stay connected forever, but that is another problem.

I have ripped by hand with a regular hand saw. Have since set up a wimpy bandsaw. I can do it just as fast by hand with less set up. The results are often better too.
Can't eat as many Snickers bars as I used to.

jim

[John Dykes]

Bob -

Bluntly.... please post more often!

Thanks so very much. I have the pieces\parts for this, but haven't had the courage to try!

[Walter Lay]

Thanks for a great tutorial. I'm curious what kind of saw set you used?
Walter

[John Schreiber]

Very nice tutorial. I can tell it was mostly written in your head while you were sawing away. Four feet per hour seems depressing though. I haven't got a bandsaw or a table saw, so what I have done is make a fence for my circular saw so that it cuts right down the middle of the board from both sides, then rip the remainder out with a hand saw.

It's not foolproof though. If you don't pay attention the handsaw can wander out of the kerf. DAMHIKT. I really like that frame saw. I plan to make one of those when I get some spare time some day. I figure on buying the spring steel and filing it into a sawblade myself.

[Robert Rozaieski]

My cutting rate for an 8 inch board is almost 4 feet per hour. A 12 inch board drops to about half that.

Bob,

Are you sure this isn't a typo? The board here was about 6" wide and 3 feet long and it took about 10 minutes with a 5.5 point saw.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2250/2400943668_c8fc919395.jpg?v=0

I would think an 8" board about 4' long would take 15-20 minutes tops. With a coarse saw (3 point or so) I would think it would go even faster. With my current saw I typically progress about 1/4" per stroke in 6-8" softwood.

[Berl Mendenhall]

Bob, thank you for the great tutorial. After reading this a couple of times it doesn't take much imagination to see re sawing could have been done very efficiently in the old days. A Master and an apprentice (or maybe just two apprentices) could saw up a bunch of stock. I intend to make one of those bow saws and a saw bench. Thanks again.

[michael osadchuk]

..... innovative and, at four feet an hour, character building; thanks for the well detailed, humourous tutorial

michael

[Bob Easton]

Thanks for all the interest and encouragement. I'll try to answer some of those questions.

Bob R. asked if I sometimes flip the stock.
Yes. It's an error recovery technique for when a cut goes astray. Yet, it's not something I would do frequently because it means unclamping both benches and takes longer than simply moving one bench.

David K. and Bob R. both asked if I had mis-prints with the cutting speed.
No mis-prints, but I didn't accurately time the progress either. I think there are a several factors to consider. Setting out to do a 2 or 3 foot board, one expects it to be a quick job and will do it like a runner doing a sprint. All of my boards are 14 to 16 feet long and I approach at slower pace like a marathon runner, sometimes sawing for three hours at a time. Sawing interruptions were for short sips of coffee (not coffee breaks), and for repositioning the benches (4-5 minutes once every 18 inches). The next factor is the length of the saw stroke. Cutting a piece as Bob R. shows, with the work canted in his bench vise, allows the full length of the saw to be used. My setup has much shorter throw, probably fewer than half as many teeth engaging with a stroke. Lastly, I observed that increases in board width caused a larger than linear increase in sawing time. The good part of this story is that speed imroved greatly with getting the saw well tuned and with experience. The last 18 inches of the last board was 10 1/2 wide and cut in about 15 minutes. That's closer to 6 feet per hour.

Jim K. is concerned about the pictures staying linked.
They will. They are on my own blog, not on some free image service that will dry up and blow away. And, Yes Jim, I can't eat many Snickers Bars either. (ole fat guy syndrome - bet I'm older than you)

Walter L. asks where I got the saw set.
I found some very reasonably priced sets at Tools For Working Wood. Two sets for less than $30. See: this link (http://www.toolsforworkingwood.com/Merchant/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=toolshop&Product_Code=MS-SAWSET.XX).

John D. Buck up your courage and have fun!

[Robert Rozaieski]

The next factor is the length of the saw stroke. Cutting a piece as Bob R. shows, with the work canted in his bench vise, allows the full length of the saw to be used. My setup has much shorter throw, probably fewer than half as many teeth engaging with a stroke.

That was my thought. A slightly longer saw may help but considering you are sawing while seated that may not be possible. I do think that a coarser pitched blade, like maybe 3 TPI, will improve the speed of the cut tremendously. I think because of the short throw of your saw that your teeth are likely clogging and likely stop cutting before they can clear the dust. Of course if it doesn't bother you then you shouldn't change a thing ;).

[Bob Easton]

... A slightly longer saw may help but considering you are sawing while seated that may not be possible.
It's not the length of the saw. It's the closeness of the shop floor. :) I got a bit more throw by propping the saw benches up on blocks, but it is still a relatively short throw.


I think because of the short throw of your saw that your teeth are likely clogging and likely stop cutting before they can clear the dust.
Exactly! Re-read the part about changing angles of attack. Dust clearing is one of the reasons to change angles frequently. Learning to do that more than doubled cutting speed.

[Eric Brown]

Found this drawing of a veneer saw. I want one now. (Need the exercise!)
112609

Eric

[David Keller NC]

Eric - There's a catch - period engravings of what you've shown in use show it as a two-man saw. I'd guess that's necessary to get 1/16" slices out of a log. So far, I've not found a willing victim that wants to help me saw my own veneer or pit-saw my secondary wood, but I'm working on it...

[Bob Easton]

Well, at least you won't need a pit ... just a helper. Looks like fun.

[harry strasil]

Nice Turoral Bob. To keep wander to a mimimum I set my saws then tape a piece of copy paper to each jaw of a smooth jawed vise machinists type vise that came out of a school woodshop and use it to clamp the teeth of my shop made webs (blades) and squeeze it tight, this makes the set even on both sides and very narrow as the teeth actually cut thru copy paper. I also when filing rip teeth use a 3 or 4 degree fleam angle so the teeth cut better and instead of scraping out the kerf, they shear somewhat like a skew angle chisel.

I have used a mirror of my own making for some time. It is infinitely adjustable as to angle and I use it on the back side when cutting dovetails to saw to the mark and also on my table saw when cutting to the mark for some things.

Work Mirror.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v81/irnsrgn/wood/workmirror001.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v81/irnsrgn/wood/workmirror002.jpg

Its just a frame with a mirror in it and a couple of triangles cut from scrap paneling with 2 screws for pivots and friction. the corner joints are tongue and fork with small 3/16 pegs to hold them in case I break it and need to replace the mirror.

[David Keller NC]

Bob - Your "mini profile" at the top of your posts doesn't state your location, but I'd be very curious as to where you managed to get eastern white cedar. I've looked for quite a while on woodfinder, and the most I can come up with is (very expensive) stock from a micro mill in eastern North Carolina. On certain Philadelphia pieces, "right" is eastern white cedar for drawer bottoms and case backs, and it's tough to find.

[Luke Townsley]

I have been following this project with great interest and am thinking of making my own saw.

I want to saw dry or semi-dry softwood like Southern Yellow Pine, Cedar or maybe even something as hard as the Mahogany-like woods. However, I may find myself cutting some pretty thick stuff like Bob was- I have a bunch of SYP now that I would like to resaw for door panels.

Also, I have a long arm span and think I want a saw with a really long throw. I am thinking about a 4' blade.

I want to make my own blade from 1095 spring steel and have been scouring the internet looking for information on how thick to make the blade. I have found almost nothing. Everybody always mumbles something about using a bandsaw blade and not liking it or buying a ready-made blade if they saw anything at all.

I think I want a blade that is 1.5-2" wide, but am totally open to suggestions. What I am really looking for is how thick to make it. The thinnest rip blade I can find is about .03" on the ECE rip saws. Somehow, that seems excessive to me for a blade that is always under tension.

What would happen if I made a 1.5" wide blade out of .02" stock for a 4' long blade filed rip with, say 3-4 tpi?

Any ideas or suggestions are more than welcome.

[David Keller NC]

Luke - You may want to check out this thread on the SAPFM forum - I asked a related question about turning saw blades, it might be helpful to you:

http://sapfm.org/forum/index.php?topic=915.0

[Bob Easton]

Bob - Your "mini profile" at the top of your posts doesn't state your location, but I'd be very curious as to where you managed to get eastern white cedar. I've looked for quite a while on woodfinder, and the most I can come up with is (very expensive) stock from a micro mill in eastern North Carolina. On certain Philadelphia pieces, "right" is eastern white cedar for drawer bottoms and case backs, and it's tough to find.

OK. Profile updated. I'm 35 miles north of New York City. My eastern white cedar is also called Atlantic White Cedar and is actually a form of juniper from lower New Jersey. A search for Atlantic White might yield better results for you, and might actually be what was used in those Philadelphia pieces. It's at the right latitude. You might also look for suppliers who sell cedar siding or cedar fencing and see if they have raw stock instead of cut to finish goods.

As an aside, for boat building, I would really like Northern white cedar, the stuff that's native to Maine. It's plentiful enough in those parts that they waste it on the sides of houses instead of conserving it for fine boats. :) ... or shipping it south.

Good luck in your search.

[Bob Easton]

Nice Turoral Bob. To keep wander to a mimimum I set my saws then tape a piece of copy paper to each jaw of a smooth jawed vise machinists type vise that came out of a school woodshop and use it to clamp the teeth of my shop made webs (blades) and squeeze it tight, this makes the set even on both sides and very narrow as the teeth actually cut thru copy paper. I also when filing rip teeth use a 3 or 4 degree fleam angle so the teeth cut better and instead of scraping out the kerf, they shear somewhat like a skew angle chisel.

Yes, I remember you mentioning that in an earlier thread. I have a better appreciation for it now and will try it the next time this, or any other, saw needs sharpening. Thanks!


I have used a mirror of my own making for some time. ...
Its just a frame with a mirror in it and a couple of triangles cut from scrap paneling with 2 screws for pivots and friction. the corner joints are tongue and fork with small 3/16 pegs to hold them in case I break it and need to replace the mirror.

Now, that's a heck of a lot better than propping up a hand mirror about a thousand times. :)

[Bob Easton]

I have been following this project with great interest and am thinking of making my own saw.
...
I think I want a blade that is 1.5-2" wide, but am totally open to suggestions. What I am really looking for is how thick to make it. The thinnest rip blade I can find is about .03" on the ECE rip saws. Somehow, that seems excessive to me for a blade that is always under tension.

What would happen if I made a 1.5" wide blade out of .02" stock for a 4' long blade filed rip with, say 3-4 tpi? ...

Maybe this little bit of experience will help. My blade is from an old rip saw, is 24 inches long, and is about 1/32 (0.031) inch thick. It is tensioned in an oak frame, not quite to "middle C," but enough to sing when plucked. A couple of times in this resawing adventure I got into situations where I let the cut get off track and in correcting it ended up with a cupped cut.

As thick and wide as that blade is, that doesn't guarantee absolute straight line results. I think one of the big reasons that people end up unhappy with using band saw blades is too much flexibility. Yes, you can get away with thinner, but you'll have to be more careful and vigilant than I've been.

Good luck with it and let us know how it works.

[Luke Townsley]

Maybe this little bit of experience will help. My blade is from an old rip saw, is 24 inches long, and is about 1/32 (0.031) inch thick. It is tensioned in an oak frame, not quite to "middle C," but enough to sing when plucked. A couple of times in this resawing adventure I got into situations where I let the cut get off track and in correcting it ended up with a cupped cut.

As thick and wide as that blade is, that doesn't guarantee absolute straight line results. I think one of the big reasons that people end up unhappy with using band saw blades is too much flexibility. Yes, you can get away with thinner, but you'll have to be more careful and vigilant than I've been.

Good luck with it and let us know how it works.

There seem to be a number of factors at work here. I assume you are sawing flatsawn boards in which case, the grain could easily lead the saw astray - particularly with a blade that is starting to dull or possibly if there is a lot of sawdust binding up. I am thinking that a bit more kerf might resolve most of that problem.

Maybe I should go with a bit thicker steel (.03" - .035") and taper the blade with a file on the back side so that I don't really even have to set the saw.

As far as band saw blades, there seem to be a number of things at work there, not the least of which, bandsaw blades are MADE for flexibility to make it around the wheels umpteen times every minute without breaking too often.

[Bill Rusnak]

Luke - You may want to check out this thread on the SAPFM forum - I asked a related question about turning saw blades, it might be helpful to you:

http://sapfm.org/forum/index.php?topic=915.0

Thanks David. Just what I need...another site to check out every day. :)

[Jon van der Linden]

Maybe I should go with a bit thicker steel (.03" - .035") and taper the blade with a file on the back side so that I don't really even have to set the saw.


This is exactly what is described for a veneer slicing frame saw in Roubo. In his description the blade is filed to a taper "to suit" and then the filing is smoothed out with a stone. There is no set. The teeth are in a rip configuration, but for ivory and exceptionally dense woods the teeth are filed to "points" i.e. more like a crosscut saw - no angles are given since the user would adjust the filing to what was being cut.

[Luke Townsley]

Hmm. That is interesting. I have been thinking about this since my last post.

I originally though the extra thickness at the teeth edge of the blade would add a bit of rigidity, but I am not so sure it would be at all significant.

After thinking about it, it seems to me that any linear (along the blade length) rigidity is a function of the tension of the blade while rigidity along width of the blade would indeed be affected by its thickness as well as the mounting method and blade tension as well as any hammered tensioning.

On the other hand, it seems that tapering a web blade would affect its tension since the thinner part would tend to stretch more easily than the thicker part. In essence, the tendency would be for the front of the blade to have a bit more tension. How much, I don't know. Neither do I know if it would affect anything. It seems that it might have a slight tendency to prevent the blade from bowing backwards allowing the use of a shallower blade depth and thereby avoiding the cost of extra steel.

My feeling is that the mounting would make more of a difference regarding blade tension than any tapering and that neither might be a big deal.

In Roubo's day, tapering the blade might have also helped to smooth out any irregularities in the steel.

I really wish I knew why Roubo tapered the blade. Maybe he just simply found it easier than setting teeth - particularly for a saw that was sharpened frequently.

[Joe Stephenson]

I am planning to make a bow, or turning, saw in the near future. I have always wanted one, but the ones that I see for sale are over-priced on my scale of values. It seems a simple project, although I may find that it's not simple when I get into the project.

I plan to build my saw around one of those marvelous Japanese saw blades. They are very sharp and last for quite a while, based on my experience with a miter saw that uses a Japanese blade. It will raise the cost, cutting into the Snicker fund, but faster more efficient cutting should lessen the need for Snickers bars.

I appreciate the post; for me it is quite timely and may well save me some time and testing.

By the by; this is my first post on this board. I am glad to have found it as it is clearly a good resource, and one that maintains a high level of content as well as a courteousness, respectful tone. I'm glad to be a member.

cheers,

Joe Stephenson

[Bob Easton]

Welcome to the board Joe!

That sounds like an interesting saw idea. Please come back and let us know how it works out. No need to come back to this thread. It sounds like a new "look what I made" thread.