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Joe Pelonio
03-02-2009, 4:42 PM
Our local paper, serving the eastside (east of Seattle) went out of business a couple of years ago. The two Seattle papers struggle, one will go away in two weeks it looks like. The other, which we get delivered to the house, is getting thinner and thinner every day.Then I just heard the major Denver paper stopped running last Friday and got to thinking. Obviously the economy
has affected their costs and their advertising revenue, but also, is part or even most of this a lack of newspaper readers, due to the internet, or even a lack of interest in the news? Maybe I'm a nearly extinct old fashioned guy, because I love sitting and reading the paper with my coffee in the morning.
When I sit at the computer for the second cup I like to read the forums.

Bruce Page
03-02-2009, 4:50 PM
I read the ABQ Journal every day. Our second large paper, the Tribune went belly up a few months ago. The internet is indeed changing the way we get our news.

Matt Meiser
03-02-2009, 5:40 PM
We stopped getting ours because it was worthless anymore. To save money they apparently don't send out their reporters and rely on police reports, meeting minutes, etc. So they get all kinds of basic facts wrong. things like the street a business is on etc. And they pretty much stopped covering anything outside the immediate area around our county seat unless it is sensational enough. For example about the only news they print from the west side of the county is freeway deaths and rumors about Cabelas selling out to a casino. They've got an online version of the paper you can pay for and print a few major articles every day for free. They let people comment on the stories anonymously and lets just say that doesn't bring out the best.

Plus we had all kinds of problems with our carrier and probably didn't get the paper once every few weeks and got it soaking wet at least once a week on average. Then we got a nasty letter from her because we complained to the circulation department and that was the beginning of the end.

Now we do get a small weekly that covers the important stuff from our side of the county. They are doing OK because the staff is 2 people and they have the contracts to publish most of the foreclosure notices which unfortunately is bringing them a lot of revenue right now.

Jim Becker
03-02-2009, 5:46 PM
We pick up a local-local paper when it's convenient to do so...our neighbor's daughter is on the staff, too. But we never read the "newspaper" in the sense of big papers. Oh, OK...I read USA Today while traveling since it shows up at my door each morning in the hotels and generally is in the airline club, too... ;)

I think that print media is going to continue to struggle greatly and with the economy what it is, ad revenue is going to depress further. That doesn't bode well for many papers that are teetering on the edge. And many of us prefer to get our "new" via online media or on the TV when we wake up in the morning. I check MSNBC.com several times a day for news including local weather, for example. It's just a regular routine now...even on my iPhone.

Chris Padilla
03-02-2009, 5:49 PM
I heard from the folks that even though the Denver Post and Rocky Mountian News combined, the RMN is officially going out of business very soon.

As a kid in Colorado, I used to deliver the RMN in my neighborhood. I earned enough money to get myself a nice touring bicycle. :)

My parents have gotten the Denver Post for as long as I can remember but once I moved out, I never bothered getting paper delivered and here I am 20 years gone...still no regular paper delivery.

Gene Howe
03-02-2009, 6:00 PM
We still get 3 weekly papers. Can't line the parrot's cage with a laptop.;)

John Schreiber
03-02-2009, 6:06 PM
It's sad when newspapers close down, but what really worries me is the loss of investigative reporters. If we don't have somebody who is paid to closely watch our elected officials and big businesses, a lot more will get swept under the rug.

Joe Cunningham
03-02-2009, 6:11 PM
I read the ABQ Journal every day. Our second large paper, the Tribune went belly up a few months ago. The internet is indeed changing the way we get our news.

Good to hear. My brother works for them as photog, though who knows for how much longer.

I get my local paper, their 'weekend' subscription: Fri-Mon. They had an editorial today explaining some changes coming beginning at the end of the month--they are moving printing to MA and closing down their local printing operation, plus making the paper 'narrower'. It is already kinda tiny.

I actually read both the print and online editions. Something about the printed word--I often read stories I'd otherwise overlook online.

Clifford Mescher
03-02-2009, 6:16 PM
Another thing that turns people off is the politics. When you favor one side over another, you automatically alienate one half of your potential customers. Clifford.

Greg Peterson
03-02-2009, 6:32 PM
John, you get to the nut of the issue.

Where is the editor to make sure the reporter is getting his facts straight, sources are accurate..... ? Online sources generally don't have the burden of a published and circulated newspaper.

Regardless the medium, the objective is still the same, generate ad revenue. But honest to goodness, gumshoe reporting is as much a thing of the past as newsprint. To stay out of trouble in the near future, just make sure you don't do anything that ends up being Googleable. If it isn't on Google, it doesn't exist.

Dan Mages
03-02-2009, 6:57 PM
I'm from a new generation. Why would I want to pay for day old news when I can access literally hundreds, if not thousands of weather, sports, business, etc... news agencies and sources for free online? If I am on a train or waiting somewhere, I can pull out my phone and check the latest headlines. If I want to buy or sell something, I don't check the classifieds, I check Craigslist. When my wife and I bought our house last year, I don't think we once looked at a printed advertisement, we solely reviewed online databases.

In today's electronic information age, printed media is not going to last unless they adapt to the times.

Dan

Joe Pelonio
03-02-2009, 7:01 PM
I'm from a new generation. Why would I want to pay for day old news when I can access literally hundreds, if not thousands of weather, sports, business, etc... news agencies and sources for free online? If I am on a train or waiting somewhere, I can pull out my phone and check the latest headlines.

Sorry, but the economics of the world has changed and not every business model is safe.

Dan
Perhaps it's the habit of sitting on the couch by the fireplace as opposed to at my work desk with the coffee. When they do go away, I suppose I can use the laptop and still sit on the couch to read the morning news.

Benjamin Dahl
03-02-2009, 7:22 PM
Dan, I don't know how old you are (I'm in my 30's) but I grew up reading the paper and still do. I don't get the local one here but get the NY Times delivered and like having it in my hands with my coffee. I also like reading news online. Flipping through the pages I often learn about something that I would have missed if I was just clicking on links.
I agree with John that if investigative reporting goes away we will all be worse off.
Ben

Chris Krysinski
03-02-2009, 7:52 PM
I have a subscription to the Wall Street Journal for both paper and online but hardly read the paper version, we either use it at the stair shop to catch the glue from getting on the floor when clamping some things or I just recycle it all. Next year I'll just order the online edition and save a tree or two.

Ed Brady
03-02-2009, 8:03 PM
We read the Colorado Springs Gazette daily. Takes about ten minutes. I hate to watch the news -- especially local news -- on TV with all the commercials and stupid stories. We read the local paper to find out what roads will be closed, what the city government is up to, etc. We supplement the ever-shrinking and worthless Gazette with the WSJ (now owned by Rupert) and get the New York Times on Sunday. I do tons of stuff on line, but I still like to sit in a comfortable chair, drink my coffee and shuffle through the paper.

The Rocky Mountain News (Denver) just folded and the Denver Post is not doing well, I think. Sad.

EDB

Mike Henderson
03-02-2009, 8:38 PM
I enjoy reading the paper but also use the Internet. As far as the lack of an editor on Internet reporting, readers act as editors. If facts are wrong, it gets pointed out quickly.

With a newspaper, the editors often have an agenda and you get that slant whether you like it or not, and you can't do much about it. As Mark Twain said of old media "Never pick a fight with a man who buys his ink by the barrel."

Mike

Joe Mioux
03-02-2009, 8:50 PM
yes, i read the obituaries every day in both the St Louis Post Dispatch and the Belleville News Democrat.

joe

Brent Leonard
03-02-2009, 8:56 PM
IMO, the internet can and will fill the void of investigative reporting when newspapers go totally belly up. It won't happen anytime soon or quickly though. not to mention, the internet ads will be maddening and only the biggest cities will have local investigative reporting.

That being said, I think it's a cryin shame these papers are going under. I am in my mid 30's, and love the newspaper. I hate getting news from the web. In fact, reading long articles on the computer is quite irritating and uncomfortable.


Does anyone think Fletch has been laid off yet??
:D

Bob Rufener
03-02-2009, 8:58 PM
We get the paper delivered daily. While reading it, most of the time, I have heard the story already either on the radio or on tv. My wife likes to get recipes out of the paper and tries many new ones. I do the daily crossword puzzle, cryptoquip and sudoku puzzles which I really enjoy. I do like to look at the box scores of local area high school athletics and also college football and basketball. I'm not a NASCAR nut but do like to see the results. I guess I find it relaxing to get the paper in the morning and spend an hour reading and doing the puzzles. A good way to start the day.

Neal Clayton
03-02-2009, 9:15 PM
yes, i read the obituaries every day in both the St Louis Post Dispatch and the Belleville News Democrat.

joe

to make sure you're not in it? ;)

btw, for avid newspaper people, a family member gave me one of these (http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00154JDAI/?tag=googhydr-20&hvadid=2733312175&ref=pd_sl_94gezpav8a_e) for christmas, and it's the greatest thing since sliced bread imo.

works over cellphone signals so no internet/bandwidth fees, and since it's a greyscale screen with no backlight it reads like paper, only without the paper. i read 3 newspapers and various other periodicals on it, and never have to fill the garbage can with paper, which is worth its weight in well...not gold but worth its weight in paper at least..

Jim Becker
03-02-2009, 9:41 PM
We still get 3 weekly papers. Can't line the parrot's cage with a laptop.

I guess we're not the only ones... :p

Dan Mages
03-02-2009, 10:37 PM
yes, i read the obituaries every day in both the St Louis Post Dispatch and the Belleville News Democrat.

joe

Looking to buy a house? :confused:

Lance Norris
03-02-2009, 10:48 PM
I havent had a "real newspaper" in 20 years. I agree with the feelings of those who get their news online. I do feel bad for my local newspaper though, because I know times are tough for them. They have a good free websight with a complete copy of the daily press. I wouldnt have any problem paying a small fee for the ability to view the paper online, but so far, they havent gone in that direction yet. Times change. Things change. When was the last time you saw a carriage shop, blacksmith shop, milkman, diaper service or an elevator operator? Everyone has "green" on their minds these days. I cant believe anyone hasnt mentioned all the trees that could be saved by not being cut down for paper production. I am currently a long distance truck driver, and read my local paper online every morning. Couldnt do that without the internet.

Dave Lehnert
03-02-2009, 10:56 PM
I read USA today often.
Cincinnati had two papers but the Cincinnati Post went belly up last year.

dennis thompson
03-03-2009, 7:11 AM
I read the Wall Street Journal every day, sure wish it had a sports section & every story wasn't about declining earnings for some company or another bailout for Citi or AIG. I was speaking to the owner of our local newspaper store & he said no one under thirty buys a newspaper.

Bob Childress
03-03-2009, 8:15 AM
I grew up on newspapers and still love them, but the times are certainly changing for print media (not only newspapers). If our local paper gets any thinner it will disappear entirely. :D

I get the national and international news from the large wire services directly on the web. But the paper carries local news that I want to know.

One challenge in this new era is preserving the news events for posterity and future historians. With all the dreck on the internet, it will be important for someone to sort and catalog the wheat and delete the chaff.

Joe Mioux
03-03-2009, 8:40 AM
yes, i read the obituaries every day in both the St Louis Post Dispatch and the Belleville News Democrat.

joe


Looking to buy a house? :confused:

nah, its a daily business indicator - part of my business deals with funerals.

Joe Mioux
03-03-2009, 8:41 AM
I read the Wall Street Journal every day, sure wish it had a sports section & every story wasn't about declining earnings for some company or another bailout for Citi or AIG. I was speaking to the owner of our local newspaper store & he said no one under thirty buys a newspaper.

i read the Wsjonline. I like it a lot.

John Schreiber
03-03-2009, 9:23 AM
. . . One challenge in this new era is preserving the news events for posterity and future historians. With all the dreck on the internet, it will be important for someone to sort and catalog the wheat and delete the chaff.
That's a very interesting idea. My first thought was that it was right on the money, but when I thought about it some more, I don't think it is right. Newspapers do filter information a certain way - a way that tends to favor the needs of newspaper editors and owners. Blogs and other Internet sources filter in many different ways. For example, we have learned a lot about history from personal letters which give facts and impressions which were never in the newspaper. I think the Internet will be well preserved into the future and data mining techniques will continue to improve. We will be able to have a wider, deeper and more nuanced understanding of history as a result.

No criticism intended. Your statement was thought provoking for me.

Rob Russell
03-03-2009, 9:35 AM
Using an iPhone is an expensive way to start a fire in the woodstove ...

Greg Peterson
03-03-2009, 5:10 PM
The Kindle is cool, but primitive in many ways, namely size and weight, but I think anyone using it will immediately understand the direction media is going.

Sony has already developed a plastic film or sheet that can display text and images. Once the scale of economy kicks in newsprint will go the way of the dodo bird. People will still pay for a subscription, but they will 'read' the newspaper off the plastic sheet.

Eventually it will become practical to subscribe to several newspapers and carry them with you everywhere. Try carrying the NY Times and WSJ onto a bus or subway today.

News will become portable and even more immediate in the future. At least that is my prediction.

John Shuk
03-03-2009, 5:14 PM
Pretty much every day.

Jude Tuliszewski
03-03-2009, 5:28 PM
I get the paper every day. I guess I am getting old, as I still like relaxing with the paper instead of a puter screen.

Scott Vigder
03-03-2009, 7:56 PM
I get it every day, I read it, I do the crossword, and I'm going to miss it when it's gone!

Ted Calver
03-03-2009, 8:44 PM
I read 2 papers--the Daily Press and the Williamsburg Gazette--primarily for news affecting area development. The papers still provide the best source of information on local government and the corresponding activities of special interest groups. Local/regional entertainment, news and coverage of local sports keep these papers alive, although the Daily press is seriously shrinking and trying all sorts of format changes in a effort to boost circulation. SWMBO only looks at them for sales and coupons and recently started getting that same information on-line. A significant portion of the Williamsburg population is over 55 and accustomed to paper reading as part of lifes rituals, so the Gazette seems strong for the near term....time will tell.

Paul Ryan
03-03-2009, 9:50 PM
Its not the same reading news from some stupid electronic device. I'm not that old yet only in my earlier 30's but grew up reading the news paper and watching the 10 pm news. Usually lots of the same stuff. But the news paper has so many smaller tid bits that the television version doesn't have time for. As for as internet news, that is for the birds. Personally I really don't care about the vandalizm spree that has went on in FL for 2 weeks, or the wildfires in NM, I want local news. What is going one with the high school football teams, just plain local news. The 5:30 national news on tv is fine and that is what the internet is for, to find out what good and bad things the president is doing, or what poor pakistani's got bomed today. And it is real uncomfortable sitting on the porcelin throne with the laptop on your lap, a newspaper is much easier to multitask with. I hope my local papers stay in businees for ever, but I am afraid they wont.

keith ouellette
03-03-2009, 11:52 PM
I know the NY times wasn't doing great even before the economy went south. They were laying people off in the beginning of 08 and even in 07. A lot of papers have the same problem. They are to involved in opinion and not printing news. We have a friend that went out of town and we would look in on his house. He was very busy and hadn't got around to reading 50 or sixty of his new york times but kept them all right next to his reading chair.

we were there right around the time of the abu ghriab mess. I sat down and looked at some head lines. One after another the front page had headlines about abu ghraib. Over and over again without there being any new information. It was senseless.

My brother in law tells me he looks at the difference between what is printed in the Boston Globe and what the associated press actually says and tells me the difference in wording is often startling (the the globe and most other papers quote from the associated press I'm sure most of you know that).

I can't help but think shoddy reporting has a lot to do with it.

Rich Engelhardt
03-04-2009, 6:43 AM
Hello,
Nope - just the Sunday flyers.

Too little news/too much controversy.

"Dog bits man isn't news. Man bites dog is news." <-that seems to be the current trend in reporting these days. Go for the controversy to increase circulation to increase sales of advertising space.

Pat Germain
03-04-2009, 8:37 AM
I used to be a big fan of reading the newspaper every day. I read the Peninsula Daily Press when I lived in Virginia. They printed many a letter to the editor from me.

When I first moved to Colorado Springs, I read the Gazette every day. Then it started to get watered down like every other paper. I had delivery problems because, these days, many of the people who deliver newspapers seem to be on the fringes of society and will suddenly disappear when they move on elsewhere. And I can't subscribe to just Sunday or just Saturday and Sunday. It's every day or Friday through Sunday; too much money for too little value.

It is really sad what's happened to journalism. Indeed, the idea of investigative reporting is almost gone. It seems almost every article is just tabloid junk or a thinly veiled advertisement. Something big can happen in my back yard and the story in the local paper is from the AP news wire. :rolleyes:

Rod Sheridan
03-04-2009, 11:10 AM
I read the paper every day.

I also read some online material.

My oldest daughter is sports editor for a large online news service. She has a degree in journalism, yet the service does no investigative reporting.

Everything is edited copy from some other source, aside from editorial content, which is probably based on content read on line.

When I express my dislike of regurgitated material, as opposed to peer reviewed, well researched articles, she looks at me over her glasses and says something to the effect of " Oh Dad, nobody has the time or money to do that anymore. It's not about reporting or investigating, it's about keeping as many of those advertising dollars as we can."

So I guess as time progresses, we'll get less and less solid, peer reviewed material, and more and more crap similar to what's available on the internet.

You know, the internet, where someone as clueless as me can suddenly have many people reading my poorly written drivel.:eek:

Regards, Rod.

Chris Padilla
03-04-2009, 11:57 AM
Eh? Did you say something, Rod? :confused:

;) :D

Joe Pelonio
03-04-2009, 12:02 PM
Here's a related interesting tidbit.

While installing signs in a Seattle office tower, I found that there is still a "press clipping" business, that has been around for over 100 years. (but I imaging the papers closing will affect them greatly) I spoke to them about the internet. Most people getting news from the internet, such as TV, radio, newspaper or press service websites do not realize that they have terms and conditions and copyright statements that essentially make it illegal to print off their content or cut/paste into other documents or e-mail. When you buy a newspaper, you own it.

That means that many companies and politicians who have their staffs look for articles about themselves on internet news websites then print it off or copy/paste and e-mail are doing it illegally.

Rod Sheridan
03-04-2009, 1:11 PM
Eh? Did you say something, Rod? :confused:

;) :D


Nope, just the usual drivel.:D

Greg Peterson
03-04-2009, 1:44 PM
I use to be hooked on reading the newspaper. But between the radio and internet, newspapers are a least a day behind the news these days. I think the Kindle is a significant step forward in news distribution. In a few short years we may all be carrying a plastic sheet of newsprint getting news updates from various newspapers throughout the day. The technology exists, just a matter of scale of economy at this point.

Of course what qualifies as news will generate a diverse range of responses and I'm not so sure this hasn't always been the case. Objective reporting is the goal, but virtually impossible to achieve. There are numerous examples of stories that didn't get printed initially that later went on to become major stories. Or what one thinks should be a major story gets relegated to a couple of paragraphs deep inside the paper where many people will never see it. As for bias, or perceived bias, perhaps what doesn't get published is as instructive as what does get published.

Harry Hagan
03-04-2009, 2:24 PM
Over twelve years ago I stopped supporting the extremely liberally biased rag that the Gannett Co., Inc. publishes under the guise of the formerly great Louisville Courier-Journal. I have an online subscription to my hometown newspaper that truly takes a balanced approach to news reporting while local TV broadcasts and websites keep me informed on what’s going on around town.

Clifford Mescher
03-04-2009, 2:57 PM
I just bought the newspaper yesterday for the first time in months. It cost me one dollar. When I asked her when the price went up (was .75 cents) she said around 3 months ago. It is noticeably smaller and thinner, too.Clifford.

Myk Rian
03-04-2009, 3:15 PM
We read our local paper every day, cover to cover. I save the comics for dinner reading.
So far, the Detroit papers are still going ok. They look alot alike since their joint-operating-agreement many years ago. That's when I stopped reading them.

Matt Meiser
03-04-2009, 6:12 PM
Uh, going OK except for the only delivering it 3 days a week (http://www.freep.com/article/20081216/BUSINESS06/81216036) thing and major cutbacks.

Burt Alcantara
03-05-2009, 5:59 PM
My wife and I read the Wall Street Journal on-line, everyday. They are increasing subscriber content every day so we will probably subscribe soon. I already subscribe to Fine Woodworking on-line. Don't want the mag. Read it all on-line. Much better deal.

I do like newspapers. They make starting charcoal for the BBQ very easy. Otherwise, they are messy, dirty and smelly.

Burt

Brian Elfert
03-08-2009, 8:05 PM
My wife and I read the Wall Street Journal on-line, everyday. They are increasing subscriber content every day so we will probably subscribe soon. I already subscribe to Fine Woodworking on-line. Don't want the mag. Read it all on-line. Much better deal.


The Wall Street Journal was the first newspaper to charge to read basically anything on their website. They rescinded that policy to allow free access with advertising, but it appears they are slowing moving back to a pay policy.

Most newspapers don't have any sort of subscription fee for their website since they don't charge anything. I think it will be a long time before we see subscriptions to newspaper web sites as Internet users want everything for free. They would rather spend 1/2 hour getting their news from various sources raather than pay to get everything at one site.

Brian Elfert
03-08-2009, 8:10 PM
The biggest reason newspapers are losing revenue and cutting jobs is lack of advertising. Classified and jobs advertising is down to almost nothing due to Internet job sites and Craigslist. Other advertisers have switched their ad dollars to the Internet or quit advertising due to the economy or they went out of business like Circuit City.

I don't believe any perceived or real bias in newspaper reporting has anything to do with the bind newspapers are in. Circulation has dropped, but not nearly as much as advertising has dropped. Total readership has actually increased when newspaper websites are included.