What's the real "skinny" on Grizzly cabinet saws?

[Jason White]

Well, I'm at a crossroads.

I've had a RIDGID contractor's saw for about 5 years, and it's a great machine. However, I've secretly lusted for a cabinet saw for the past year or so (though my wife might argue not so secretly!).

I was convinced that I wanted an old, used Powermatic 66, and have seen a few on Craigslist. Unfortunately, most of them have been 3-phase.

I've read a few posts from you folks with Grizzly machines. So, what's the real poop? For those who own a Grizzly cabinet saw, are they good? Has the cast-iron top stayed flat over time? Any major problems? Will the saw last me 50 years? Are the cast-iron router table extension wings anything to write home about?

For around $1200, the price certainly seems right. But I know you usually get what you pay for.

Jason

[tody Brock]

I've 'had the Grizzly 1023 with the 52" extension table for about 3 yrs. All I can tell you is I love it. The cast iron has stayed flat. Everything on it is true, one thing I did have problems with, the blade tilt was off .5*, but is an easy fix if you check it before you get it completely put together. I have never owned a PM66, but have used one a few times and for $1000 difference, this was a no brainer for me. I would buy another in a heartbeat.

[Don Morris]

I'm a serious hobbyist. I've had a Grizzly 1023SL for about 4 years now and it's a gem. It's pretty much a clone of the Unisaw. I put a Biesemeyer drop in splitter in it without any modifications. The tables were flat when I got it. Checked with an expensive 36" machinist bar I bought for evaluating level/straight. Don't know about the 50yr result, that will have to wait, but from all indications, it's going to outlive me. From what I see here on the "creek" from owners it's a best bang for the buck machine but maybe a notch below top of the line performers. But the difference would be hard to detect. I know that when I was looking, several people who made their living using the TS were using the 1023SL and loved it. So Grizzly can't be that bad.

[Gene E Miller]

Greetings & Salutations,

I too have a 1023S and am soooo happy with it and what it does.

I have had mine for a little over 3 yrs now and that was when you could get it for $825 and because I ordered the saw, band saw, lathe, jointer and drill press all at the same time my total freight was only $200.

The only thing I regret and am going to remedy it very soon is that I did not get the 72" rail extensions for the table. The saw was very easy to setup and it is accurate and has stayed that way. I have less than .001 run out from the front to the back of the blade and I check it about once a week. Usually on Mon or Tue like a habit.

I have nothing but good things to say about all my Grizzly tools and have had only one or two minor problems but Grizzly's customer service and Tech support have been second to none as far as I am concerned. I think you will get excellent value for the money spent.

As to how much I use my saw I am in my shop usually 4 - 5 days every week building something whether it is remodeling something in the house or building some type of furniture. If I had unlimited resources I still think I would purchase Grizzly, maybe a more expensive unit but it would still be Grizzly green.

Thats my .02 worth anyway and as they say thats my story and I'm sticking to it. :D:D

Gene

[glenn bradley]

I'm sure more 1023 owners will chime in as that TS has been as popular for Griz as the 490 has been for them in the jointer arena. After seeing several different machines I often wonder what that extra $1000 is supposed to be for(?). Don't get me wrong, griz seems to have a number of tool offerings where I would choose another manufacturer but, the 1023 seems to be one of the good ones.

[Steve H Graham]

If I had my table saw shopping to do over again, I wouldn't let 3-phase scare me. Very often the price of a VFD is so low, a used 3-phase tool is a bargain even with the added gadgetry.

[Sonny Edmonds]

I chose to put my money into one of the last things made in America, a Unisaw.
At least I know I will die happy. :)

[Gary Elore]

Jason;
I graduated from a Crapsman contractors saw to a Griz 1023 a number of years ago. I've never had the pleasure of using one of the big Generals or Powermatics, so I can't really say how the 1023 would stack up. That said, my 1023 with the Biesemeyer fence I put on it, is my favorite shop tool. I can't imagine needing a better/bigger saw for the kind of woodworking I do.

As for lasting 50 years --- I'm 58 now and I'm pretty sure, barring a major disaster, that my 1023 will outlive me. It's 10-11 years old now and still going strong.

Gary

[Dwain Lambrigger]

I have the Shop Fox version of the Grizzly 1023, and love it. I read and understand Sonny's point about the Unisaw. I look at this as a Time/Money issue. I would love....LOVE to buy an old Unisaw and restore it, but I don't have the time (or the skill level). I would really love to buy a PM 66, or Sawstop (but I can affort the cost). Griz offers a very good saw at a very competative price. It is nice to buy a new saw, put it together, and get working. Now, if I could find the Unisaw or PM 66 at the right price, in great working order, I would probably prefer that, but that doesn't matter, because I have my saw now, and I am very happy.

Good luck on your search. I hope you know what you want, then find what you are looking for.

[Neal Clayton]

how are you having trouble finding used PM66s and Unisaws?

in this day and age with cabinet shops going out of business left and right, i would think there'd be a multitude of them for sale.

[Greg Johnson]

I have had a 1023SL for about five years now. Out of the crate, everything was true and accurate. After breaking in the belt, it passed the "nickel" test no problem. (Start it with a nickel standing on edge and it doesn't tip over) Virtually no vibration, which was such a pleasure after my previous saw. There is no comparison.

Greg

[Chris Padilla]

I have a 1023Z from Grizz (purchased in 2000) that is still going fine today. In fact, it still has the original belts on it! However, I've got my Snarfer (RSS reader) combing eBay and CL for used Sawstops and I would pick on of those up in a heartbeat if I could find one. I am only doing this due to the economy and potential availability. Otherwise, I cannot complain about my Grizz TS...it has been perfect.

[scott spencer]

The Griz 1023 has a huge happy following....honestly, it's got to be one of the most popular cab saw purchases of those bought in the last 8-10 years. I've used two 1023s that were great, and now own a nearly identical Shop Fox W1677 that's also great. I've used a Jet 3hp cab saw, and honestly didn't notice much difference between them all. I think you'd have to get into a PM66, General 350/650, Saw Stop, or old Uni to do much better.

At this point, I'd be tempted by the new G0690/G0691 over the 1023....riving knife and updated fence. Either way, if a Griz cab saw floats your boat, no reason not to go with one.

[Jason White]

I still have one of the last "real" Biesemeyer fences that I picked up on closeout at Lowe's for super cheap some months back. Been saving it for when I get a cabinet saw.

Anybody know if this will fit the Grizzly without any major modifications?

Also, is a real Biesemeyer any better than the stock Grizzly fence? I know it's a clone, but the plastic faces look nice and slick.

Jason

[Aaron Berk]

Any one seen one of these in action yet?

http://www.grizzly.com/images/catalog/2009/main/029.jpg

[Keith Outten]

I own a Grizzly 1023 that is right at 17 years old now. I purchased it when I built my workshop and it still has the original belts and works as good and is as smooth running as the day it went into service. The cast iron is still in perfect condition and I have several offers from people who want to purchase the original cast extensions that I recently removed.

I can't remember the original fence but I replaced it with a Beis fence right after I received my 1023. Over the last couple of months I added two Quality Grinding steel table saw extension wings to the old girl, both with router raisers in them. New life for a very old saw :)
.

[Dave Cav]

I have had one for eight years or so. It replaced a Rockwell Contractor's saw. I used that contractor's saw for almost 15 years and did a lot of stuff with it, but there's no comparison to the Grizzly. No problems at all. I have the Shop Fox fence and extended rails; highly recommend both.

Dave

[Rick Moyer]

how are you having trouble finding used PM66s and Unisaws?

in this day and age with cabinet shops going out of business left and right, i would think there'd be a multitude of them for sale.

I thought I wanted a used PM66 and looked for quite awhile. Nothing close (within100 miles) especially 1 phase. I live within 1/2 hour of Grizzly and have several Grizzly tools. I am now rethinking what would be best for me and think I will eventually get their new cabinet saw with a riving knife. I am very happy with the bigger Grizzly tools I have. Some lesser priced things they sell are junk, but many of their bigger tools are great values. I don't know if the older Unisaws or PM66's are better, but I have seen the 1023's etc. and believe they are very close to the quality of the previous "benchmark" tolls of yore. I have decided I should have a riving knife as I currently don't use a spliiter or anti-kickback pawls and I probably should. If I fell into a good deal on a better used cabinet saw I would likely go for it, but the 1023 and newer Grizzly saws are very good IMO.

[Ron Brogan]

I have had a 1023S for about eight years and couldn't be happier. I entered my search back in 2001 pretty much predisposed to buying a Unisaw. That was based on using older machines in a college cabinet class; and another older machine owned by a former neighbor. At the time Unisaws were difficult to see in local stores, but when I saw one in a KC store I was disappointed. The table machining, handwheels and other features seemed to be of lower quality finish. I had a chance to go the the Springfield Grizzly store and saw a close clone to my Unisaw memories - 1023S! A Griz demo saleman took me back to their demo shop and fired up a well worn and slightly beat up machine they used daily. Passed the nickle test on startup. The Shop Fox fence is a good clone to the Beiz but it does look different. The machine set up easily and has held setup with few adjustments. If you want to see one, Grizzly will provide names of two folks in your area that have bought similar tools recently. I did this too and the local owners finished me off. One fellow bought one for himself and two more for his sons.

I would recommend the 1023S to anyone.

[Andrew Joiner]

I have had the Shop Fox version of the 1023 for 5 years. It's a good saw and a great value.

I had a new PM66 in heavy use from 1971 to 1990. I went through 3 baldor motors with it so it was pushed hard all those years. It cut as true in 1971 as it did when I last used it in 1990.

I can't say the PM was better in any way than the 1023. I would have to use the 1023 for many more years to say it's as durable as the PM,but so far so good.

[Don Dorn]

Well, the testimony of those having them over 5 years should be taken very seriously. I have had mine right at 4 years now and can be counted as one who loves it. In my woodworking club, there are members who have PM66s and Unisawas and they are definately nice saws - however I have no regrets as I don't see that mine lacks anything in the way of vibration, power or flatness to those.

The way I see it, as long as the table is flat, the trunions are heavy (which they are), the controls work well, and the arbor spins true, it will last a lifetime even if I had to replace the motor. Very happy with the decision and my brother bought one too after using mine.

[Stan Johnsey]

A vote for holdin' out for somethin' used like a PM66 or Unisaw. I looked for awhile on Craigslist and eBay. Started out lookin' for Unisaw and then branched out to include PM 66. Don't get me wrong, new is nice but you can probably buy a Unisaw or PM 66 and you widow will make a profit on it when you die. An advantage of used is that $1,200 is $1,200, no tax or shipping, etc. With used you are likely to get a few extras.

I ended up with a '93 PM 66 3hp, 1phase Baldor motor, Biesemeyer 52" fence, Forrest WWII blade, Old Dubby sled, assorted push stick for $1,200.

[Stephen Edwards]

Though I don't have that saw I do have several Grizzly machines. They are very well built machines. If I were looking to purchase a new table saw, Grizzly is the first place I'd look, based on past experience with their other machines that I have, top notch customer service and reviews by so many happy owners here at the Creek.

Another thing that I consider when buying foreign built machines is that when we purchase them we're still supporting American jobs. Lots of them! Just because they're manufactured abroad doesn't mean that lots of American jobs aren't necessary to get the machines from point of manufacture to your door.

Finally, I appreciate a company whose president and owner regularly visits and addresses questions and issues on this forum. That speaks volumes to me about their overall business model.

[Sue Wise]

I guess I win, as several years ago I bought a used Grizzly 1023SL on Craigslist. It was in near new condition. I purchased a Shark guard for it and I love it.

-Sue

[Jason White]

Wow -- I didn't expect this old thread to get revived again!:)

I did end up getting the G1023SLX. Left-tilt, 3HP motor and it came with a router table extension wing and Shop Fox T-square fence. I already sold the router table (replaced it with my Bench Dog) and am in the process of selling the stock fence (replaced it with a Biesemeyer that I've been saving for something special).

So far, I'm very happy with the Grizzly! Only adjustment required was shimming up the left wing a hair. I also installed a new RIDGID 50-tooth ATB blade. The saw runs smooth as silk and has plenty of power. I ripped 8/4 red oak last week and it didn't even wince!

If I had to do it again, I probably would've gone ahead and installed the Shop Fox fence that came with the saw instead of the Biesemeyer. Would've bolted up much easier (no drilling, tapping, etc.). Not sure the Biesemeyer is that much better, but I have to say it is really nice.

I do HATE the stock guard and splitter!! Hard to adjust, hard to remove, etc. etc. All I really want is a splitter (without a guard) that will come on and off easily. Will probably make my own or get an aftermarket one at some point. Then I'd like some type of overarm/overhead guard more for additional dust collection than anything else.

Just my $.02.

Jason

[Stan Johnsey]

What did you use for shim to shim up the wing? The right on my PM66 is a hair low.

[Chris Padilla]

What did you use for shim to shim up the wing? The right on my PM66 is a hair low.

Most hardware stores have brass shim stock on hand but an aluminum pop can will work, paper, cardboard, cereal box...get the idea? :) I used masking tape for my extensions when I level them up 8 years ago and it has worked just fine...they haven't budged since.

[Jason White]

Small pieces of brass shim stock from Lee Valley.




What did you use for shim to shim up the wing? The right on my PM66 is a hair low.

[Steve Clardy]

1023 here. Bought new in 1995 I think. I use it almost every day.

Parts replaced
1 set of belts
1 switch replacement
1 centrifugal switch on the motor
Upgraded the fence


I would buy it again if necessary

[Ed Hazel]

What did you use for shim to shim up the wing? The right on my PM66 is a hair low.
I have use feeler guage for shimming the nice thing is you have a nice selection of thickness to chose from