Panel Door Question

[Steve Mellott]

Specialty router bits can be used to cut the panels in a raised panel door. They are designed to cut a 3/8" tongue (some people call it a 'flat') on the edges of the panel to slip into the groove. This flat allows the panel to expand and contract.

Instead of using a router, some people use a table saw to bevel the edges of the panel for a raised panel door. Using a table saw, I don't think you can include this 3/8" flat tongue. Instead, the bevel is constant to the end of the panel - meaning that the stile contacts the panel at a single point rather than along the entire width of the flat. Will the absence of a flat create a problem if the panel expands or contracts. Without the flat, it seems like an expanding panel might crack the stiles and a shrinking panel might rattle in the stiles.

Please help me to understand this. Thanks.

[frank shic]

no, the bevelled panel cut on a table saw will not cause expansion dificulties as long as you size the panel correctly to allow for expansion - i use 1/8" on all sides so i subtract 1/4" from the height and width of the space that is created by the dado in the completed frame. it's one of the fastest methods although you do have to take some extra steps to keep the panel riding upright against the fence and it's slightly riskier since the blade is exposed but i built an accessory fence to prevent accidents.

lee explains the process in great detail with pics:

http://home.earthlink.net/~us71na/raisedpanel.html

[Mike Heidrick]

I would like to see that panel in the frame of the door. Still would angle into the frame on the top of the panel right because it lacks the flat?

[Frank Drew]

Steve,

I think your concern is well-placed; you'll never get as good a fit with the tablesaw method as with a dedicated router or shaper cutter, nor will the edge of the field be as crisp since the table saw blade will likely undercut somewhat and that will have to be squared up.

But the tablesaw is better than nothing and I've done it that way with okay results.

[Brian Peters]

It's a personal preference, some say its fine some don't. I say that the beveled edge inside the groove will work for small doors but I would NEVER trust that in a larger panel or door. I prefer a 3/8" flat always with a 1/16-1/8 subtraction around for expansion. Although I do it all on a shaper router tables are very affordable to setup no reason why you couldn't do it on a router table with router bits.

[Chip Lindley]

Think about it! Panels were made exactly this way with hand planes 200 years ago with good results!

If a panel with constant taper expands in the slot, the angle of the panel field only expands against the inside edge (profile bead) a very small amount as the width of panel expands. As this wedge expands, it will only press against the *bead* a tiny bit more over 1/8" travel (typically) There would be much more pressure if no space were left in the groove and the panel edge pushed directly against the stile directly. IMO there should be no problem if the parts are designed and machined correctly.

[Brian Peters]

Not saying it won't work you're definitely right has been done this way for a long time but saying given modern technology and better tools/tooling you should go with flats and not worry about it at all.

[Lee Schierer]

Steve,

I think your concern is well-placed; you'll never get as good a fit with the tablesaw method as with a dedicated router or shaper cutter, nor will the edge of the field be as crisp since the table saw blade will likely undercut somewhat and that will have to be squared up.

But the tablesaw is better than nothing and I've done it that way with okay results.

Using my method for making panels, I'll stand my panels next to anyones for eveness of the edge. Raised Panels on a TS (http://www.home.earthlink.net/~us71na/raisedpanel.html) I started making panels with the TS making the face cut and cheek cut with the TS, but LOML didn't like the sharp corner left by the face cut so I came up with a router face cut and thebevel cut on the TS that works really well. I will admit I can't do teh complex curves on the bevel that a router bit can do, but you can't beat the TS method for cost.

[Frank Drew]

You're right, Lee, if you define the field before cutting the bevels you can get the edge as clean as you'd like; it's been so long since I used the table saw method that I was forgetting that step. I sold my left-tilt saw and bought a slider with a right-tilting blade around 1987, so cutting raised panels on the saw was a moot point from that point on.

I'd still prefer using a shaper, though, because I like the flat tongue the shaper cutter leaves -- I think it makes a neater fit into the frame grooves but I agree it doesn't make a huge difference.

[Peter Quinn]

Think about it! Panels were made exactly this way with hand planes 200 years ago with good results!

If a panel with constant taper expands in the slot, the angle of the panel field only expands against the inside edge (profile bead) a very small amount as the width of panel expands. As this wedge expands, it will only press against the *bead* a tiny bit more over 1/8" travel (typically) There would be much more pressure if no space were left in the groove and the panel edge pushed directly against the stile directly. IMO there should be no problem if the parts are designed and machined correctly.

I have some old drawings that show panels WITH a flat made with hand planes, which is not possible with a TS. Maybe the TS is the modern method with issues and the router or shaper simulates the real OLD methods in a quicker easier format? Lets break apart some antiques and verify this issue! I think shakers used the beveled edge panels, but of course they ran the raised field to the back, though the design seems to have worked well for them. I have never made panels with a TS and can't speak from personal experience as to its efficacy, but it makes a great treatment for back beveling table edges.

[Chip Lindley]

I never said it is the BEST way to make panels, I only meant to suggest that *acceptible* panels CAN be raised on the TS, IF it is the only tool you own. I did considerable *fretting* over just such a delimma years ago, before I owned a nice shaper and nice Freeborn cutters. With correct geometry, a nice fitting panel can be raised on the TS!