SMC Collaboration 01: Keepsake Box

[Jim Kountz]

Ok guys for the last couple of days my good friend Dewey Torres and I have been talking back and forth both here in PM's and on the phone about a pretty cool concept that we hope will be something really special and perhaps even start a trend here at SMC.
This is what we want to do.
Take a simple project such as a small box or something, pass it around all over the country to fellow creekers and have each one add their own touch to it. We realize that a small project like a box would only require a few people but as I said this could be a start of something new for SMC. We thought we would take a simple box, made of walnut dovetailed together with an opening for a small drawer at the bottom. I would take care of supplying the wood for the initial box and get it over to Dewey who would then add some of his spectacular inlay work. Then it would be off to someone else for some base moldings then some carving and finally some finish. Each person involved would be responsible for shipping to the next guy or gal so we feel by keeping the project small it would be easier on everyone.
We're doing a box, perhaps some others folks here would want to do a small table or cabinet of some kind. The idea here is not to show off or say how great thou art but more to get to know each other better and have a chance to do something we wouldnt normally be able to do, work with each other on a single project.
The final project we would like to either raffle or donate it for a cause whether it be SMC or another worthwhile effort.
So, what do you guys think?? We are looking for a carver, someone to do the moldings and any other suggestions you guys may have. We have a finisher in mind already and like I said good ol Dewey will take care of the inlay work.
If you want in just let me or Dewey know and we can go from there. If you cant get in on this one, start another project with your circle of friends or however you want to work it!! Best part is have fun with it and build something nice!!

[Don Bullock]

Dewey & Jim, I like the idea. Since my home and shop are in transition from one location to another and will be for quite some time, I'll opt out of participating this time around. I'd love to see the progress though. Perhaps, after I finally get settled in the new place I'll be able to participate.

[Jim Kountz]

Don, thanks for the encouraging words and by all means, when you get settled we'll do it again and you have a spot reserved just for being the first to respond!!

[Ken Fitzgerald]

I'll turn the knob or knobs for the drawer.

[Jim Kountz]

You got it Ken!!

[David Christopher]

Jim,Dewey I think thats a great idea. maybe everyone envolved could sign the bottom or something like that

[Jim Kountz]

David thats a good idea too, this is what I was looking forward to the most, getting ideas from others, stuff I hadnt even thought of. Thanks!!

[Robby Tacheny]

Excellent idea! I think the last step of the process should be to sell it in some sort of charity auction or donate it to a deserving non-creeker. Of course that's up do the guy providing the wood.

I wish I could provide some service to the box, but I am trying to finish a dresser, rearrange my shop, and then I am going to be making several bandsaw boxes and other small boxes for my first craft show.

-R

[Keith Outten]

Jim,

Let me know if you can't find a carver. I may be able to provide a CNC carved rose or other detail for the top of the box. I have the new Aspire 3D software but I'm not proficient with it yet so it might take a couple of attempts :)
.

[mike holden]

Jim,
Put me down for some feet on your box. Right now I am thinking ogee bracket style, but, let me see the box first!
Mike

BTW, Dewey has my contact info.

[Jeff Mohr]

Great idea! One day when my skills are refined enough I will volunteer my services to some part a project like this.

[Dewey Torres]

Other Ideas:

LASER COMMUNITY

Why don’t we involve the Laser folks to put all of our names on the box bottom just before the finish? Thoughts?

HINGE MAKERS:
Any folks who can do wooden hinges?

LID HANDLE:
I know of some Creekers that are very good at these, some who even have stickies on hand made ones.

THE GUTS:
Anyone want to tackle the inside? Lift outs? Flocking? Other?

THE ONLINE CONTRIBUTORS:
For all those who are not able to participate in the hands on portion, you can still contribute your design ideas but we need them before the construction starts. Extended of course, to this crowd it "what to do / sell / the final product". Putting together the raffle, advertizing, etc.

All participants who need my contact info please PM. Some of you already have it.

[onur cakir]

Count me in for design (traditional designs specially). I would love to do something physical but shipping costs a lot to Turkey...:o

[Steve Clarkson]

Dewey,

Thanks for inviting the laserheads to your project.

I'd be happy to contribute in any way that I can.

One thing that I would suggest is that before the box is assembled, that might be the time to send it to the laser folk, since alot of us are limited by the size of an object. For example, my laser bed is 12"x24" and the clearance is 9". Furthermore, if you sent it out before it was assembled, you could send one side to 4-6 different people and the shipping costs would be less. Oh......and of course......the last benefit to doing that is when I screw up my side of the box, you won't have to replace the WHOLE box!!!!

Let me know if you need me.

Steve

[Tim Bateson]

I'm on board & I like the idea of donating or auctioning off the piece, maybe to help pay for this great forum.

[Don C Peterson]

Terrific idea! The logistics might get a bit hairy but it should be fun for both those involved and those who just watch it happening.

[Dewey Torres]

Be it Jackie or Jackie and someone else, we will need to coordinate the carving effort with the inlay efforts. I can do most anything I just want to make sure it matches.

[Dewey Torres]

Jim,
Let's find some sketchup guru and draw this thing up so folks can give more feedback. What we need is for someone to draw up what we have so far and save the file on your computer so we can get inputs from the creek and modify to fit.

I would do this but with my SU skills it would take us forever.


Sketchup person,
So far it is a walnut box roughly 16" x 11" (not sure if height but have to put it in a standard cardboard box) with a pullout drawer on bottom front with two turned knobs, a jewelry box style lid and classic ogee style 2 part feet.

Any takers please respond before you start working so we don't have a bunch of folks attempting to draft at the same time. … or maybe that isn’t such a bad idea???

[Chris Padilla]

I'll be happy to provide some MAJOR chip-out or cut something too short for the next guy to fix!! ;)

Inlay sounds nice but how about some nice crotch figure or something?

Here is an idea of a jewelry box I made a long time ago: Jewelry Box (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=7940)

[Chip Peterson]

I'd be happy to do some laser engraving on it. Perhaps "Sawmill Creek", or everyone's names on the bottom?

[Mike Mackenzie]

I would be happy to donate the Laser Work. You can PM me when that part is ready.

[Jim Kountz]

Wow I just got home and checked this thread, it has BOOMED!! Thanks to all who has replied and offered their services. I can see this thing getting huge before its all done and the start of something really cool here.
Right now we need a sketchup guy unless we just want to do this the old fashioned way which is fine too. I love the idea of the names lasered on the box somewhere.
Dewey, call me my friend we need to get things squared away.

[Dewey Torres]

I genuinely had no idea the response would be this great so that was my fault for underestimating the Laser crowd! It is about time we joined forces.

There are three of you signed up and we need only one. SO...

Mike Chip and Steve:

Steve was here first and has my contact info so he gets first crack. Steve you have the floor. Yes or no?

If not then Chip then Mike. Does that sound fair to you all?

[Jack Harper]

If you decide to laser it after construction, I can do it so long as it does not get any larger than 6'x10'x2'. Also, I don't see the need for a waterjet, but just know one is available should you need it.

[Dewey Torres]

If you decide to laser it after construction, I can do it so long as it does not get any larger than 6'x10'x2'. Also, I don't see the need for a waterjet, but just know one is available should you need it.

Thanks Jack. The plan is for about 11"x16 so far so that sounds like it will fit. I have no earthly idea what a water jet is:confused:. We should have it covered but as I said above you laser guys are great! Thanks.

[Jim Kountz]

Ok folks heres what we got so far:

Myself - basic box construction
Dewey Torres - Inlay work
Keith Outten - CNC work
Ken Fitzgerald - Turned knobs
Mike Holden - Ogee bracket feet
Ed Salle - Interior flocking and/or partitions? Ed what do you think?
Steve Clarkson - Laser work
I think we have a finisher but Im not 100% just yet. If the person we're talking to doesnt or cant do it, then that will be up for grabs too so keep your eye on this thread.

Still looking for someone with Sketchup skills to do an initial design for us. If anyone is interested please contact myself of Dewey for more details.

We're on our way!!

[Steve Clarkson]

Steve you have the floor. Yes or no?


I'd be honored to do it.

[Dewey Torres]

I'd be honored to do it.

Ok Steve you are in!

[Jim Kountz]

Ok Steve you are in!

Nice to have you on board Steve!!

[Dewey Torres]

Ok folks here we go!

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/picture.php?albumid=119&pictureid=1168

[Chris Padilla]

Fine, I can do the sketch-up. I only have the freebie version but I'm not too bad with it.

What did you think of the box I built and provided a link for? Something like that? What kinda interior are we looking at?

[Jim Kountz]

Ok group lets Welcome Chris to the list of contributors, hes our sketch up guy. Chris PM me when you get a chance and we can talk size, shape etc. And as usual if anyone has any ideas for ANY part of this let us know. The more input from everyone the better I say!!

[Jim Kountz]

Im happy to announce that Jim Becker has agreed to do the finish work for the project. As you guys know Jim doesnt post much here :rolleyes:so it was good to have him on board!! Welcome Jim and Chris.
Jim also suggested a charity for us to think about, Bridge Of Hope. Its the hosting program he met his daughters through.
Add that one to the list which now consists of:
St Judes
Habitat for Humanity
Bridge Of Hope
Jim Kountz porch rebuild fund. (Just kidding folks!!:D:D) For those who dont know or didnt see my post, my truck got away from me on the ice this weekend and I ran into my front porch!!

Anyway sans the front porch project, all the above charities are all good ones and its really just a matter of picking one I guess. Most everyone I have talked to seems to gravitate towards something that helps children and Im all for that, after all they are our future right!!??

[Jim Kountz]

Chris, I think the size of the box you linked to is definitely in the ball park. My original thoughts were a simple dovetailed box with a drawer at the bottom and a lid that had some overhang on top. Single board thickness for the lid. The feet or base would let the piece stand up a bit and add to the overall height. I was also starting to think of incorporating some lighter wood in the top, perhaps maple for example just so any laser work would show up better?? I guess this is a question more than anything as I dont know squat about the whole laser thing and what it can/cant do. Wide open for thought here so dont be shy folks step right up!!

[Larry Browning]

My original thoughts were a simple dovetailed box

There is about a 0% chance of this being a "simple" box with the crew you are assembling here. This is going to be one fancy box!

I think this is a great idea! I can't wait to see the finished product and all the progress reports and pictures along the way.
It might be a good idea to document this project in a blog instead of a thread. It might be easier to manage that way.

[Dewey Torres]

Updated maphttp://www.sawmillcreek.org/picture.php?albumid=119&pictureid=1186

[Chris Padilla]

Let me work on putting together a basic box and then we can add details to it until we find the more or less final look.

Lets keep ALL communication in this thread so that anyone at anytime can go back and read/reference the thread to ascertain the evolvement of the project.

I can post .JPG files from SU because it is likely that the SU file will be too large to post here directly.

I'll work on this tonight and post some stuff over the weekend.

[Doug Shepard]

Looks like all the bases are already covered.
I can provide the all-important cat hair for the finishing process if you come up short there:D

[mike holden]

Hey Doug!
I am doing the feet, and I am in Clinton Twp., when the box gets to me, do you wanna help?
Mike

[Dewey Torres]

Looks like all the bases are already covered.
I can provide the all-important cat hair for the finishing process if you come up short there:D

Doug,
If you are interested you could make a handle for the lid or if you are any good at wooden hinges. Otherwise we will likely use hardware for the hinge and one of us will make the handle.

[Doug Shepard]

Hey Doug!
I am doing the feet, and I am in Clinton Twp., when the box gets to me, do you wanna help?
Mike
Got the PM - that sounds good.


Doug,
If you are interested you could make a handle for the lid ....


Sure. Sign me up for a handle. I've got enough various woods lying about that I'm sure I could find something that would work out with the overall look. I could even dress it up by inlaying the handle. I've still got paua abalone pieces left over from my plane pimping adventure
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showpost.php?p=936909&postcount=2
or malachite, brass, contrasting wood, yada, yada, yada...

[Dewey Torres]

Got the PM - that sounds good.



Sure. Sign me up for a handle. I've got enough various woods lying about that I'm sure I could find something that would work out with the overall look. I could even dress it up by inlaying the handle. I've still got paua abalone pieces left over from my plane pimping adventure
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showpost.php?p=936909&postcount=2
or malachite, brass, contrasting wood, yada, yada, yada...

Ok Doug... you are in! Since you live so close to Mike and you two will be working on it together that is great because we won't have to ship another time! Perfect!

[Dewey Torres]

Ok all!
Here is what we need to do next:
Jim and Chris - work on initial design and post:

Once we have a general look at the box, everyone should start working on "designing" their parts. Unless your part of the build prohibits, please do not wait on the box to arrive to start designing. Some of you won't be able to do anything "build wise" until the box arrives but others will be able to at least get the general design together and maybe even start now.

The idea here is to keep the box moving. We have purposely set the builds up where everyone should have but a small simple task for their part and be able to get it in the mail to the next person fairly quickly without rushing the artists. If any member should run into a snag, please post so the group can help. We don't want the box to sit and not be worked on so try to be ready when it comes.

Let’s also be careful of the climate differences. Who ever ships to me has to know that the box is going to shrink in the first week. Likewise if I shipped the box to one of the east coasters it will likely swell. This is especially important for the lid and the interior.

Additionally, please try now to identify possible conflicts with your portion of the build end everyone else’s.

Ed,
You are making a simple lift out tray with divided compartments (you decide the divider dimensions well as the depth of the tray (should be shallow like a jewelry box), and leave the rest open in the bottom, then do the flocking. If you are not comfortable with the tray, I vote Chris does it, but if so then it is your baby but we need a reply.

Steve,
Final say is up to you as it is with each building member, but if you think it would look good, how about the SMC logo on the bottom middle and Collaborated by: "xxx" names / what they did to the box in smaller font under each name surrounding the centered logo, with the charity fit in as you see fit? Could we each send you a digital signature or is that too much? If we do the engraving right after Jim K. and leave room for Mikes feet, each could sign it in sharpie as they get the box...just a couple of ideas. Chris, can you help here and work with Steve as well?

All,
I will begin coordinating a routing / shipping order for the box and I will post it. Once I do this, please, everyone make a sanity check first and then we will finalize and exchange addresses and contact info as needed.

Did I forget anything so far???

Would anyone who did not get to participate like to handle logistics or help me with them?

Would anyone be interested in a wooden hinge? Last call! If we don't get a taker for this I need the Creek to throw up some recommendations on hardware. All can play!

[Chris Padilla]

I was kinda hopin' someone had done the Incra wooden hinge or has the kit to make them....

[Doug Shepard]

I was kinda hopin' someone had done the Incra wooden hinge or has the kit to make them....

Oh I got the jig. Just never used it yet and wouldn't want to guinea pig this poor project with newb stooopidness. Got all wrapped on stuff like epoxy floor painting, cyclone DC, workbench, doghouse, and numerous other things since buying it and so far I've only learned how to open the box.:D

[Larry Edgerton]

I have a box of Cocobolo hinges that I made up here somewhere, depends on the size of the box. They were made for jewlery boxes, but I got on a roll and made a whole box full.

[Chris Padilla]

I have a box of Cocobolo hinges that I made up here somewhere, depends on the size of the box. They were made for jewlery boxes, but I got on a roll and made a whole box full.

Larry,

Please post some pics/sizes of your hinges...I could scale the box to fit them.

This kinda reminds me of that commerical on TV where a couple walks into a high-end architect's office and plops a fancy looking faucet on his desk and asks him, "Design a house around this."

[Doug Shepard]

Be it Jackie or Jackie and someone else, we will need to coordinate the carving effort with the inlay efforts. I can do most anything I just want to make sure it matches.

I was thinking the same thing with regards to the top handle. This could turn into kitchen-sink-itus if we're not careful. I was originally picturing some sort of handle on the top of the box but the more I think about the other competing design elements up there, I think maybe a 2-part handle along the front edge and box with a couple small rare mags to close it? Might make for a cleaner canvas for the inlay/carving ??? I'd probably want to get a rough idea of what the turned drawer knobs would look like too, regardless of whether it's a top or front type handle.

[Doug Shepard]

One other thought, and maybe this is something that Ken and I might want to coordinate on between the knobs/handle. But here's a few wood choices I have available.
Ebony - both Macassar and Ceylon (or it might be Madagascar, but it's black)
Holly
Picasso Rosewood (this is what Ron Brese calls it. He sent be some small pieces left over from one of his plane builds after I sent him some extra abalone plugs)
Paduak
Cherry
Mesquite
Walnut
Maple
Macacauba
Myrtle
Mango
Ipe
Purpleheart
Sycamore
Jatoba
There's probably something else lurking in the No-Kill Wood Shelter that I'm forgetting...

I tend to think one of the darker ones would be better for this but???

[Steve Clarkson]

I was also starting to think of incorporating some lighter wood in the top, perhaps maple for example just so any laser work would show up better?? I guess this is a question more than anything as I dont know squat about the whole laser thing and what it can/cant do. Wide open for thought here so dont be shy folks step right up!!

Jim,

I think that the lighter and softer the wood, the better the engraving will show up. Maple should be fine, but there are a few hardwoods that would be a problem.

I can engrave it as lightly as possible so that it almost looks like it was printed on there with ink and it doesn't "feel" like it was engraved. Or I can burn it "deep" but then it looks....burned!

I can mask it with tape before I engrave it and then color fill it with any color paint.

I can engrave using any font and I can engrave any graphic or photo (just in case you wanted to incorporate Dewey's mug on the box).

I can engrave out the text.....or I can engrave everything BUT the text. I'm including two pictures of illustrating this technique. These two items were cheap basswood pieces that I picked up at Michaels and donated to one of our local schools that was having a fundraiser to benefit a summer camp for terminally ill kids.

I would also prefer that someone else choose the font and layout, as I'm not very creative!

[Jim Kountz]

Wow Steve thats impressive, I dont know much about the lasers but it looks like they are amazing tools. So to you and everyone else what about incorporating a maple or similar top? Maybe a frame and panel top where the panel is maple? Thinking out loud here. Also the only reason I was using Walnut was I happen to have a nice 60 year old plank about 12" wide and 6' long that I have been hoarding for some time now. Since we have yet to begin we are not locked into anything yet.

Deweys mug on the top? Hhmmm LOL

[Steve Clarkson]

Yea.....the LASERS are amazing! You guys have talent....I just know how to use a computer!

If you want to go with a dark wood, here is a picture of a cheap winebox showing the engraving color filled with a gold paint.

[Larry Edgerton]

Larry,

Please post some pics/sizes of your hinges...I could scale the box to fit them.

This kinda reminds me of that commerical on TV where a couple walks into a high-end architect's office and plops a fancy looking faucet on his desk and asks him, "Design a house around this."

I'll dig out the box of hinges this afternoon. I have not seen them in years so I can not remember the size exactly. I made them in long lengths so they could be cut to the desired length. I may have other species. I will send you a pair for a start, and you can build your house around them.http://www.sawmillcreek.org/images/icons/icon12.gif

[Dewey Torres]

... (just in case you wanted to incorporate Dewey's mug on the box)...

Please don't! That is a guaranteed way to make this the ugliest box known to man and would not sell. We would have to pay someone to take it;)

[Jim Kountz]

Yea.....the LASERS are amazing! You guys have talent....I just know how to use a computer!

If you want to go with a dark wood, here is a picture of a cheap winebox showing the engraving color filled with a gold paint.

I like it Steve! We'll give the others a chance to chime in here but it looks good to me so I think walnut would be fine. I started thinking and I just dont want it to turn into "Frankenbox" with too many mixed matched woods would everyone agree?? So if we can keep it walnut flavored I think that might work better. Just my opinion though mind ya.

[Jim Kountz]

Dewey, we need to go ahead and make a decision on the charity, I think that has to me on the top of the box dont you??
For everyone that doesnt know, after talking with Keith Outten our fearless admin, it was suggested by Keith that we do the box for an outside charity and not for SMC. This would show an effort on the part of SMC to reach out for to the community and help others which in turn would come back 10 fold to SMC. I agree with Keith here so I have been researching charities and trying to decide on one. I thought maybe later today or tomorrow I will make a new post listing all the prospective choices. We will put it to a vote with EVERYONE not just the collaborators voting, we'll do it in POLL format. I think this is a great way to determine the charity. In the meantime you guys hit me with your suggestions so I can add them to the master list.

[Chris Padilla]

Well, look at that. As far as I know, only a MODERATOR or ADMINISTRATOR can upgrade a post to a sticky! :D

Okay, I've attached some exported .JPG files from SU of the jewelry box I posted about in my earlier post.

The purplish colors are the flocking and fabric areas. The tan parts are plywood. The cherry colored pieces (sorry, no walnut color available in my SU) are, well, solid cherry (1/2" stock, internal divider is 1/4" stock).

I don't have any details about joinery or sliding mechanism for the drawer. I also don't have any details for hinges or necklace holders, pouches, etc.

The lid has a figured "inlay" on it.

I'll work on posting the SU file (too big for a direct attachment here) a little bit later so that others can use it.

So let's start with this one and start modifying it to whatever y'all want. I'm not married to this but since I could grab my wife's jewelry box and copy it in SU, it was a good place to start.

[Dewey Torres]

All,
We have all of the builders we need at this point so box construction will start This weekend. What we do need it a list of volunteers to take on the projects of each builder in case we get into a jam causing the box to sit and not be worked on (IE. If Jim wrecks his truck into his house and can’t work on the box for another 3 weeks;)).

If interested sign up here or PM me or Jim.

Also the build is now closed. We have so many ideas we can barley think strait so we are just going to get it started with what we have now and go for it. As for the wooden hinges please contact Jim ASAP as he needs those built into the design for the lid.

[Dewey Torres]

Here is what I had in mind for the bottom. Can you do this?

[Doug Shepard]

Here is what I had in mind for the bottom. Can you do this?
How about adding the URL in parenthesis under the logo?

[Dewey Torres]

How about adding the URL in parenthesis under the logo?

EDITED ABOVE

How does that look?

[Doug Shepard]

Ya shoor youbetcha;)
Just thought it might make it easier for the final recipient to drop in and say Hi.

[Steve Clarkson]

Here is what I had in mind for the bottom. Can you do this?

Should be no problem. Can I get the Sawmill Creek logo in a vector format?

[mike holden]

Chris,
This looks good, but will have to add some feet. I was thinking of something like these, but scaled appropriately. They are attached to a frame with molding. The molding is higher than the frame pieces so it contains the carcase.
With something this small we can eliminate the molding and the frame will attach directly to the feet. Then the frame will attach to the case. Will probably inset it to match the inner opening of the bottom.
This means that the area for lasering will be diminished by about an inch all around to allow for this frame.

Also, the feet and frame will not have a "back" side and will look the same on all four sides.

Mike

109321 109322

[Larry Edgerton]

I found a box of hinges, but not the box with the Cocobolo. I have walnut, maple, jatoba and one I am not sure of any more but it may be sapele. So now I need to know species that will tie into the program. And an address to send them to....

Oh, and the way this forum inserts posts where it will makes it hard to follow. No one with new information should quote a old post or it gets lost in the middle.

[Dewey Torres]

I found a box of hinges, but not the box with the Cocobolo. I have walnut, maple, jatoba and one I am not sure of any more but it may be sapele. So now I need to know species that will tie into the program. And an address to send them to....

Oh, and the way this forum inserts posts where it will makes it hard to follow. No one with new information should quote a old post or it gets lost in the middle.

Maple and walnut are a match made in heaven...my vote!

[Dewey Torres]

Should be no problem. Can I get the Sawmill Creek logo in a vector format?

Steve.
I don't know what vector format is? I can send you the original files but they will have to be converted. They are JPEGS now but I drew the originals up in powerpoint and then converted them so I could post.

[Rick Gifford]

I may have missed it in a different post. But what will you do with the finished item?

Maybe auction it off with proceeds to the Creek?

Or half Creek and half charity...

Winner gets a cool project.

[Doug Shepard]

...
I'll work on posting the SU file (too big for a direct attachment here) a little bit later so that others can use it.
...


How about just emailing it to all those involved?

[Jim Kountz]

Here is what I had in mind for the bottom. Can you do this?
Dewey I love it!! I think its great, nice job!!

[Jim Kountz]

Chris,
This looks good, but will have to add some feet. I was thinking of something like these, but scaled appropriately. They are attached to a frame with molding. The molding is higher than the frame pieces so it contains the carcase.
With something this small we can eliminate the molding and the frame will attach directly to the feet. Then the frame will attach to the case. Will probably inset it to match the inner opening of the bottom.
This means that the area for lasering will be diminished by about an inch all around to allow for this frame.

Also, the feet and frame will not have a "back" side and will look the same on all four sides.

Mike

109321 109322

Mike, thats EXACTLY what I had in mind, excellent!!

[Jim Kountz]

Well, look at that. As far as I know, only a MODERATOR or ADMINISTRATOR can upgrade a post to a sticky! :D

Okay, I've attached some exported .JPG files from SU of the jewelry box I posted about in my earlier post.

The purplish colors are the flocking and fabric areas. The tan parts are plywood. The cherry colored pieces (sorry, no walnut color available in my SU) are, well, solid cherry (1/2" stock, internal divider is 1/4" stock).

I don't have any details about joinery or sliding mechanism for the drawer. I also don't have any details for hinges or necklace holders, pouches, etc.

The lid has a figured "inlay" on it.

I'll work on posting the SU file (too big for a direct attachment here) a little bit later so that others can use it.

So let's start with this one and start modifying it to whatever y'all want. I'm not married to this but since I could grab my wife's jewelry box and copy it in SU, it was a good place to start.

Ok Chris see what you can do with the following:

Make the front all on one plane with the drawer inset and flush with the front. Maybe thin the top down somewhat so it isnt as high.
I talked with Dewey and we are thinking either a flat one piece top with a routed edge or a frame and panel. If we go with frame and panel Dewey can veneer the plywood core for the panel and then do his thing on it. If its solid then he would more than likely go with an inlay.
Since Keith is adding some CNC carving to the top, just say for examples sake a rose or something, Dewey and I thought it would be nice for him to inlay some leaves and such around it so as to accent the carving and not "busy" it up. I really like that idea alot. Looks like Mike has a fantastic design on the feet/bottom assembly so we are moving forward,
keep the train a'rollin!!

Jim

[Steve Clarkson]

Steve.
I don't know what vector format is? I can send you the original files but they will have to be converted. They are JPEGS now but I drew the originals up in powerpoint and then converted them so I could post.

That's OK.....I can work with whatever you send me. Send both if you can (the PP and JPG)....maybe one would work better than the other.

Just as an FYI....a vector file can be scaled without the loss of any resolution.....whereas a JPEG would look horrible if you tried to make it 6'x6'. Vectors are just easier to work with.

[Doug Shepard]

... Maybe thin the top down somewhat so it isnt as high.
...


That might not much room for a front mounted handle. Unless you folks want to go with a top handle, which I think is going to make fitting it in around the inlay and carving more complicated. How tall is the top in the existing SU model? And how tall from the lower drawer opening to the top opening? And much much were you thinking of thinning down?

[Jim Kountz]

That might not much room for a front mounted handle. Unless you folks want to go with a top handle, which I think is going to make fitting it in around the inlay and carving more complicated. How tall is the top in the existing SU model? And how tall from the lower drawer opening to the top opening? And much much were you thinking of thinning down?
Not much Doug just kind of lighten it up a bit so the top is not quite as heavy looking, make any sense?? Again this depends on whether its a one board flat top or a frame and panel design.

[Jim Kountz]

Also to Chris and well everyone I guess. Dewey and I were talking today and the point was made that we dont really need to go the jewelry box route at all. This could be just a keepsake box or something like that. Thats kind of what we had in mind in the beginning.

[Dewey Torres]

That might not much room for a front mounted handle. Unless you folks want to go with a top handle, which I think is going to make fitting it in around the inlay and carving more complicated. How tall is the top in the existing SU model? And how tall from the lower drawer opening to the top opening? And much much were you thinking of thinning down?

Here is what I was thinking but imagine horizontal (and yes Doug, on the front not the top)... maybe somehow without the plates behind it. Does this make sense?

I want you all to know we are just throwing ides up. When the box gets to you, use your own artistic talent and send it away as best you can.

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/articles/9/pulls_1.jpg

[Chris Padilla]

Ok Chris see what you can do with the following:

Make the front all on one plane with the drawer inset and flush with the front. Maybe thin the top down somewhat so it isnt as high.
I talked with Dewey and we are thinking either a flat one piece top with a routed edge or a frame and panel. If we go with frame and panel Dewey can veneer the plywood core for the panel and then do his thing on it. If its solid then he would more than likely go with an inlay.
Since Keith is adding some CNC carving to the top, just say for examples sake a rose or something, Dewey and I thought it would be nice for him to inlay some leaves and such around it so as to accent the carving and not "busy" it up. I really like that idea alot. Looks like Mike has a fantastic design on the feet/bottom assembly so we are moving forward,
keep the train a'rollin!!

Jim

Well, the front is all in one plane. I just drew everything in an exploded view so that idividual parts could be seen. Please see the link for the original jewelry box for clarification.

I added a few flavors of some feet. The two back ones are the same, 1" high and tapering on two sides. There is one roundish one and a conical one. I tried a "bun" but it didn't look right since the lines of this box are a bit simpler.

I tried adding a molding/leg detail like Mike called out but it looked to big and heavy and out of place to me for the size of box and style as I've drawn it. It fits well with his "chest of drawers" box but not so much this box...I feel.

[Larry Edgerton]

Chris,
This looks good, but will have to add some feet. I was thinking of something like these, but scaled appropriately. They are attached to a frame with molding. The molding is higher than the frame pieces so it contains the carcase.
With something this small we can eliminate the molding and the frame will attach directly to the feet. Then the frame will attach to the case. Will probably inset it to match the inner opening of the bottom.
This means that the area for lasering will be diminished by about an inch all around to allow for this frame.

Also, the feet and frame will not have a "back" side and will look the same on all four sides. I would just need to upscale it a bit.



109321 109322


Mike

I have a couple of boxes in my shop that have a scaled down version of what you have there. I'll take a picture and post. they do look good on a small box when scaled down. have to run to the shop.

Chris, I figured out my problem. In my settings I was on Hybrid, so I had this weird tree that did not show all posts. I changed it.

PS. Mike did you make that chest? I think it has perfect proportions and the drawer arrangement could not be better. I need to make one for my wife and I would love to see more of it.

[Ed Sallee]

I think it would be a great idea to pick up nice looking journal, maybe even with wood book covers - somebody can make? We can document the craftsman, materials used, date received, date sent out and to whom.... etc...etc..etc...

It would be nice for whoever winds up with the box to have a project log, journal to go with it.

It can even be incorporated in to the box design - leaving a drawer at the bottom or somewhere or a false bottom - to specifically hold the journal - forever?

Just a thought.

[Doug Shepard]

Here is what I was thinking but imagine horizontal (and yes Doug, on the front not the top)... maybe somehow without the plates behind it. Does this make sense?

I want you all to know we are just throwing ides up. When the box gets to you, use your own artistic talent and send it away as best you can.
...


Well I would hope to have it built long before it ever gets to me but front mount would be better I think too. That would also potentially limit (at least in the handle area) any shaped edge profile on the top corner that someone mentioned earlier. I'm kicking around a few top mount ideas for backup plans but here's what I'm generally thinking for a front mount type.
- A 2 piece design as if one piece was on the box before the lid was cut off and cut right through the handle
- Lower piece would be flat and not as wide as the top piece. Top piece would have a shaped finger pull profile as well as a shape - maybe something like your rotated handle, maybe something else. I'm also toying with having the central portion of both pieces not meet in a straight line even with the box edges but have the top project below the lid in the middle into a matching profile in the lower piece.
- Small rare earth rod mags into the edges of both pieces to work as a closing latch.
- Tapped holes for brass machine scews into the back of the pieces with countenbored holes from the inside so the screw heads dont stick up. Make the through holes on the box just slightly larger to allow for a bit of adjustment in case of box expansion/contraction.

At this point I've started to think of this as my Stevie Wonder handle:D. I have no idea yet what it should look like without first seeing some box design directions, SU dimensions, etc. so I'll have to wait and see what comes out along those lines. Ideally there would be enough info available that I could be working on this simultaneously with other work and show up at Mike's with something ready to attach (short of putting the holes on the box).

[Larry Edgerton]

Same idea but a little less of it......

[Pat Germain]

Wow, this a great thread about a great project! It looks like all the bases are covered. Since I live just down the road from Dewey, I'll be sure to supervise his work carefully and provide moral support. ;)

Seriously, if there's anything I can do to help, I'd be glad to do so.

[Chris Padilla]

Same idea but a little less of it......

I like Larry's base/legs for this box so I incorporated it to one section.

I thinned down the lid a 1/2" (to 3/4") and grew the sides/back/front by that 1/2" and killed the divider for jewelry since we want to go more for just a box.

[Chris Padilla]

Wow, this a great thread about a great project! It looks like all the bases are covered. Since I live just down the road from Dewey, I'll be sure to supervise his work carefully and provide moral support. ;)

Seriously, if there's anything I can do to help, I'd be glad to do so.

I think hourly calls on the weekend to ensure he is working on it will suffice, Pat! ;)

[mike holden]

Ed,
I like your idea about a journal. Hopefully we can document the build as we go along here on the creek, then we can print it out and make a journal from it.
Mike
"the leg man"

[Steve Clarkson]

Well, if you plan to put the charity's logo on top, maybe we should rule out all charities with complicated logos.....lol.

[Ed Sallee]

Jim, Dewey - can you post a little summary of who's doing what? I've lost track and there are a lot of sub-threads that are getting difficult to find.

[Chris Padilla]

Post #45 (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showpost.php?p=1043898&postcount=45) does a very good job, Ed.

[Jim Kountz]

I like Larry's base/legs for this box so I incorporated it to one section.

I thinned down the lid a 1/2" (to 3/4") and grew the sides/back/front by that 1/2" and killed the divider for jewelry since we want to go more for just a box.

Ok Chris, I think between your renderings and others suggestions I have enough to go on, I started prepping the lumber yesterday and just generally laying things out. Here we go!

[Doug Shepard]

Chris
Any luck on getting the SU file loaded somewhere that we can get at it? Or emailing?

[Keith Outten]

This is the Rose 3D graphic I have. It can be carved on the top, sides or front, where ever you think is appropriate. If you don't like the Rose I have other graphics that may be suitable.

Here is a link to the eagle I carved in Corian.
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=107778&d=1232721206
Another option might be to install a Corian medallion into the top of the box.
.

[Chris Padilla]

Very nice stuff, Keith!

[Jim Kountz]

This is the Rose 3D graphic I have. It can be carved on the top, sides or front, where ever you think is appropriate. If you don't like the Rose I have other graphics that may be suitable.

Here is a link to the eagle I carved in Corian.
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=107778&d=1232721206
Another option might be to install a Corian medallion into the top of the box.
.


Keith, thats really nice!! Couple of questions. Could this be made as an applied carving and could you leave the leaves off? Reason I ask is if it were applied then Dewey can do some inlay around it, such as the leaves, stems etc. What do you think?

[Dewey Torres]

Keith, thats really nice!! Couple of questions. Could this be made as an applied carving and could you leave the leaves off? Reason I ask is if it were applied then Dewey can do some inlay around it, such as the leaves, stems etc. What do you think?

I can work with it either way. If it is applied before I get it, it will limit how close I can work to it but it will be treated as a motif. If it comes un applied I may likely integrate it.

With or without leaves will work for me. I am flexible. What ever condition it comes to me in I will work it out and it will look good.

The only variant is time.

[Keith Outten]

Jim,

This is what an applied carving would look like....or something similar depending on the size. The smallest ball nose router bit I have is 1/8" diameter. In order to get this kind of detail on a very small piece I will most likely have to order a 1/16" diameter bit.

I can load the rose graphic and see if the leaves can be removed. I am pretty sure they can, the Aspire 3D software can combine multiple items into components, if this is how the designer setup this file it would be relatively easy to remove the leaves.
.

[Jim Kountz]

Nice!! Only trouble I see is now I may have to get me one of those CNC's!! Really cool stuff, Ive been looking at the Shopbot for a few years now and just havent taken the plunge yet. Is that what you have??

[Keith Outten]

Steve,

I think I have the SawMill Creek vector files, i will have to check. Awhile back I had a computer that had hardware problems and I ended up losing some of my SMC stuff, that's why I am not sure of the files at this point.

I'll get back to you ASAP.
.

[Doug Shepard]

Chris
I got the SU file and started assembling the parts so I could start laying some test rectangles on it to figure out some handle proportions. But when I use the dimension tool I'm getting different numbers from the size that was mentioned previously (post #20 & 27 which had 11x16). Did this change to 7x12? The lid also comes up 1" shorter at 7x11??
109654

[mike holden]

Sanity Check Time!

Okay,
Basically, given the early post: “

“So far it is a walnut box roughly 16" x 11" (not sure if height but have to put it in a standard cardboard box) with a pullout drawer on bottom front with two turned knobs, a jewelry box style lid and classic ogee style 2 part feet.”

What we are making is, in basic form this:

109707

So, lets go over the design criteria.

Purpose:
A group build – builds camaraderie and teamwork
Show Off – our talents and techniques
Raise Money for Charity – a noble cause and eliminates who gets it when done (grin)

Now, if the end purpose is to have something of value, that a stranger would want to possess, then we need to ask this question: Why Buy It?
To Help the Charity – primary motivation in this type of sale
The Object is Desirable – something pretty to have/show
The Object is Useful – I get some value for money besides the tax write-off

Okay, helping the charity is a given, that the object will be desirable should be a given with the skills we have assembled, utility though – what is the intended use of our object?

Currently we are at 8 by 8 by 12 ¾” for the box, feet would be 1 1/3” high by 2” wide. We got here because the board that Jim has is 8 inches wide, and 8 by 12 3/4 is close to a golden section.

The frame to hold the lasered panel and attach the feet to, will consume ¾”
The drawer runner/guide/frame attachment will consume another ½”
The drawer would be about 9 inches wide and 2 inches high, and start 1 1/4 inch from the bottom.
The upper kicker/guide/compartment bottom support will consume another ½”
This consumes: ¾” + ½” + 2” + ½” + ¼” = 4”

Now, from the top, we have 4” left for the lid and the flocked compartment, with a slider

” Ed,
You are making a simple lift out tray with divided compartments (you decide the divider dimensions well as the depth of the tray (should be shallow like a jewelry box), and leave the rest open in the bottom, then do the flocking. If you are not comfortable with the tray, I vote Chris does it, but if so then it is your baby but we need a reply.”

So, to balance the design, the lid should be cut to mirror the bottom cut of the drawer, 1 ¼” from the top.
This leaves 2 ¾” for the compartment, so 1 to 1 ½” for the slider means that this makes sense dimensionally

“Chris, I think the size of the box you linked to is definitely in the ball park. My original thoughts were a simple dovetailed box with a drawer at the bottom and a lid that had some overhang on top. Single board thickness for the lid. The feet or base would let the piece stand up a bit and add to the overall height. I was also starting to think of incorporating some lighter wood in the top, perhaps maple for example just so any laser work would show up better?? I guess this is a question more than anything as I dont know squat about the whole laser thing and what it can/cant do. Wide open for thought here so dont be shy folks step right up!!”

:Make the front all on one plane with the drawer inset and flush with the front. Maybe thin the top down somewhat so it isnt as high.
I talked with Dewey and we are thinking either a flat one piece top with a routed edge or a frame and panel. If we go with frame and panel Dewey can veneer the plywood core for the panel and then do his thing on it. If its solid then he would more than likely go with an inlay.
Since Keith is adding some CNC carving to the top, just say for examples sake a rose or something, Dewey and I thought it would be nice for him to inlay some leaves and such around it so as to accent the carving and not "busy" it up. I really like that idea alot. Looks like Mike has a fantastic design on the feet/bottom assembly so we are moving forward,

Not much Doug just kind of lighten it up a bit so the top is not quite as heavy looking, make any sense?? Again this depends on whether its a one board flat top or a frame and panel design.”


With the overhang, we have developed the box to this:

109708

(Picture is roughly to scale)

Okay so far?

Now, since we are making this in walnut and maple, and the box will be walnut; what do people think of a maple top and maple feet?

Mike
"The leg man"

[Jim Kountz]

Im with you so far, another question for you, since the box is 3/4" material do you think maybe a mitered construction would look better than dovetails on something this size? Im just wondering if the larger pins and tails would look bulky on something 8x8x12. Whaddayathink?

[Chris Padilla]

Chris
I got the SU file and started assembling the parts so I could start laying some test rectangles on it to figure out some handle proportions. But when I use the dimension tool I'm getting different numbers from the size that was mentioned previously (post #20 & 27 which had 11x16). Did this change to 7x12? The lid also comes up 1" shorter at 7x11??
109654

It is amazingly easy to screw up the dimensions when trying to draw it in an exploded view!!

What?! You donta likea shorter lid??? Looks good to me! ;)

All I did was render the jewelry box I made for my wife into SU as a place to start. We can certainly change dimensions as Mike H. above has alluded to. LIke I said, I'm not married to my design but I felt it was a good place to start since I had something physical I could look at and measure.

Do we want to increase the box size as Mike suggests?

[mike holden]

Jim,
Regarding mitered versus dovetails, ummm, hard to call.
The miters would be clean, the dovetails interesting.
Since this is for a public auction, dovetails are something the public associates with fine woodworking, so consider that aspect.
Dovetailed cases were the joint of choice in period furniture, though often covered with moldings.
I dont think you could go wrong with either choice.

Construction wise, in a mitered joint, would you reinforce the joint? Would the reinforcement show at the lid when opened?

In a dovetailed joint, tails front or side? How large? End grain tends to be darker under a finish, what does our finisher think?

Mike

I would vote for mitered, but it is your call. mh

[Doug Shepard]

Sanity Check Time!
....


Thanks
I needed that.


...All I did was render the jewelry box I made for my wife into SU as a place to start....

My bad. I thought the SU file was something you put together based on what had been described here so far. Thought I'd throw the question out here in case there had been a bunch of PMs circulating that changed the size. I guess I missed some of the things that Mike brought up regarding the change due to the available board width.

So we're going with 8 x 8 x 12 ¾” ? With a 1-1/4" lid then?
I'll play around with SU tonight to see if I can figure something out.

[Dewey Torres]

I vote to stay with the dovetails.

[Chris Padilla]

Okay, I updated the box to the 8" x 8" x 12.75" dimensions--or it should be close depending upon joinery method.

I gave the lid a 1/4" overhang all the way around. BTW, everything is 1/2" stock but I see that maybe we need to go with 3/4"? Actually, the top is 3/4" but the box/drawer/drawer front...all 1/2".

I hadn't noticed the ability to upload a LARGE zipped up file so I have included the .SKP file as a zipped up file: box1.zip (box1.skp).

Cool!

[Jim Kountz]

Not much to look at right now but its a start. I havent made any cuts yet just laying things out and getting ready.
As you all know there are at least two main ways of wrapping grain around a box. The first method simply starts at the end of the board and goes in sequence, Front, Left, Back, Right. I never liked this method too much simply because when looking at the front of the box you really only have one corner that is a true grain match in the order it was cut from the board. Years ago a fellow (my granddad) showed me that if you center the front piece between the two sides, then no matter what angle of view from the front, the grain appears continuous. So thats what Im doing here. This puts any non-aligning grain matches in the back of the box.
So here we go, also I would still like to get everyones opinion on whether or not to dovetail this box or miter it, my only thinking was that since its 3/4" material the larger pins and tails may look bulky on a box this size. So opinions? I can do it either way and it makes no difference to me I just thought some of you may want to chime in on this.

[Jim Kountz]

Jim,
Regarding mitered versus dovetails, ummm, hard to call.
The miters would be clean, the dovetails interesting.
Since this is for a public auction, dovetails are something the public associates with fine woodworking, so consider that aspect.
Dovetailed cases were the joint of choice in period furniture, though often covered with moldings.
I dont think you could go wrong with either choice.

Construction wise, in a mitered joint, would you reinforce the joint? Would the reinforcement show at the lid when opened?

In a dovetailed joint, tails front or side? How large? End grain tends to be darker under a finish, what does our finisher think?

Mike

I would vote for mitered, but it is your call. mh

If I went with miters I would more than likely spline them with a nice contrasting wood, if I went with DT I would like the front and back to be the tail boards. This is just my preference though.

[Dewey Torres]

Looks good as is Jim. I still vote for the DTs!

[Chris Padilla]

Dovetails are just very cool no matter how you slice it. I have a kit that does "fake" dovetails but adds a nice touch to any joint:

http://www.dovetailspline.com/

I bought this like years ago and never used it. If you're interested, holler, and I'll send it to you this weekend.

[mike holden]

Chris,
We are getting closer.

A couple changes, and these drawings may help.

Note that the drawer front does not go all the way across, there must be room on the sides of the drawer for the guides, which are necessary to attach a frame to. This frame will both allow for attachment of the feet and carry the laser image of Sawmill Creek and our names.

109744

This is the inside of the case with the front removed. Frame fits inside of case, and flush with bottom. Frame attaches with screws to the drawer guides, the cutout in the drawer guides matches the opening in the front panel. Sitting on top of the drawer guides is the bottom panel for the upper compartment. Ed Salle can tell you more about that area.

109745

Also, the drawer does NOT have a false front, it is built with half-blind dovetails.

109747

I have also drawn up the foot, this view should be full-size, each square is one-quarter inch. The position relative to the case is shown above. There is a half-inch of each foot outboard of the case. They will be one inch thick.

109746

Hopefully, you can use this to help create the sketchup of the foot.

Mike
"The Leg Man"

[Chris Padilla]

[Snapping off a salute to Admiral Holden]

Sir, yes, Sir! :D :D

You are stretching my Sketch-Up skills, Mike!! ;)

But that is cool...it'll force me to improve. :)

Your second drawing of the carcass seems to show a 1/2" thick bottom. Is there any plywood in this box?

[Jim Kountz]

Ok Ive made some headway. Got the front panel components cut and glued up, all the pieces for the front were from one board. I ripped then jointed the pieces back together so as to keep grain harmony and a nice square opening.

Also got the jig set up for the dovetails. By the way:
My name is Jim, and I cant handcut dovetails.:eek: Not afraid to admit it!!:D

Anyway I set the first pin width 1/8" wider than the rest to allow for cutting the top off and still retaining the same width. This was taking into account the kerf my bandsaw makes (1/16") and some clean up work fitting the lid back to the case (1/32" ea for both the top and case = another 1/16").
If anyone has any requests as to spacing of the dovetails speak now for tomorrow it will be too late!!;)

[Dewey Torres]

It's alive!

[Larry Edgerton]

Jim, PM me an address and I will send you the hinges. What species? Walnut I would think.....

[Pat Germain]

FYI, I dropped a line to our fellow SMC member Marc Spagnuolo about this collaborative project. He agreed it was interesting and posted a link to this thread on The Wood Whisperer blog. I hope that's OK. :)

[Jim Kountz]

FYI, I dropped a line to our fellow SMC member Marc Spagnuolo about this collaborative project. He agreed it was interesting and posted a link to this thread on The Wood Whisperer blog. I hope that's OK. :)
Wow now thats just cool!! We'll take all the free advertising we can get, it would have to help out the proceeds I would think!!
Thanks Pat!!

[mike holden]

Chris,
The "bottom of the upper compartment" is shown as 1/2 inch in thickness. This may be the only piece of plywood in the structure, the edges are completely hidden, and the upper surface will be flocked, the lower surface can only be seen by removing the drawer and looking up into the drawer opening (not bloody likely mate!)

Mike
"The Leg Man"

[mike holden]

Jim,
Looking Goooood!

Remember now, the Wood Whisperer is watching - Grinnnnn!

Mike
"The Leg Man"

[Chris Padilla]

Okay, I'm getting closer. Still have some more details to bring in. :)

[Chris Padilla]

I added the drawer guides and some dimensions and I believe they are correct. Please double-check for me (Mike) and tell me if you agree or not.

I also added the bottom of the inside of the box and including some colored flocking on it to make it clear.

I'll add the new SU file later when I have more detail. I hope to have the leg and its profile posted by late Friday.

Everything is 3/4" stock now except the flocked board, which is likely to be a piece of 1/2" plywood.

[mike holden]

Chris,
Lookin Good!

Mike
"The Leg Man"

[Chris Padilla]

Okay, I think this might be finally IT! :D

[Jim Kountz]

okay, i think this might be finally it! :d

B-I-N-G-O!!:d

[Dewey Torres]

Larry,
Can you post a pic of the hinges you have?

[mike holden]

Looks Great Chris!

Now to make it look like that.

Mike
"The Leg Man"

[Chris Padilla]

Mike,

Did you plan to miter the legs? I need to figure out how to get that to work in SU as I was having a difficult time getting the shape to "turn the corner" for me.

Rendering up the dovetails was interesting. I did 7 degree dovetails centered every inch although I didn't include the kerf for lid removal.

I will also do the half-blinds on the drawer. Just more fun details to figure out!

Do we have all the various wood species figured out? I could color it up better if so. Do we know the color of the flocking planned? What about details like handles and the hinges or the motifs Keith showed? I still have a figured top in my rendering that came from the jewelry box--what is planned for this area?

[Doug Shepard]

... What about details like handles and the hinges or the motifs Keith showed? ...

I'll get something done up in SU for the handle hopefully within couple days and if passes musterwith everyone I'll attach the modelso you can paste it onto the box.

[mike holden]

Chris,
Right now, the case will be in walnut, and the feet in maple. Not sure of the rest, but I would hope the top is also maple.

Re: the feet, yes they are mitered.

109929

Hopefull this gives you a better idea.

Mike

[mike holden]

Okay Group!

Picked up a board of curly maple to make the feet and laser plate (help me with what to call this, the board that will carry the creek logo and the builders names) out of.

109942

109943

There has been some discussion about adding a small molding around the bottom, and if we go that route, then I have enough material in this board.

Mike

[Chris Padilla]

I'll get something done up in SU for the handle hopefully within couple days and if passes musterwith everyone I'll attach the modelso you can paste it onto the box.

Excellent, Doug! Yes, please feel free to add it to whatever latest version of the box I choose to post and it'll be incorporated from there on out.

[Chris Padilla]

Right now, the case will be in walnut, and the feet in maple. Not sure of the rest, but I would hope the top is also maple.

Re: the feet, yes they are mitered.

##########################################

Picked up a board of curly maple to make the feet and laser plate (help me with what to call this, the board that will carry the creek logo and the builders names) out of.

There has been some discussion about adding a small molding around the bottom, and if we go that route, then I have enough material in this board.

Mike

Mike,

Sounds good on the feet/case. I will see if I can figure how to miter the shapes in SU. I'm sure it is easy but everything is easy when you know how to do it! :D

I had thought that the design of the feet could carry right across the base and act as a combo molding/foot design. I can do that easily in SU and so I will post that this weekend for us to mull over. If you look at some previous .JPGs I posted, I did that on one sample of a foot/molding I designed.

"Laser Plate" it is. I assume this is the solid hardwood board on the bottom of the box, correct? I can recolor it maple and maybe even text some names and the SMC logo on it so things are clearer.

[Doug Shepard]

... and laser plate (help me with what to call this, the board that will carry the creek logo and the builders names) out of.
...


Provenance Plank?:confused:

[Jim Kountz]

Ok group we need a batting order, where does the box go when it leaves here, which it will probably be doing tomorrow or Monday at the latest. (depends if I can get to the ups store tomorrow.)

[Dennis Peacock]

Shoot....just count us all in. :)

[Chris Padilla]

Ok group we need a batting order, where does the box go when it leaves here, which it will probably be doing tomorrow or Monday at the latest. (depends if I can get to the ups store tomorrow.)

Jim,

What stage will the box be at when you send it off? What have you completed?

[Jim Kountz]

Progress!! Well folks my time with the little box is drawing to a close. As you can see in the picture I have everything fitted and ready for glue up, the box is actually in the clamps right now. I would have had this done last night if Dewey would have let me get off the darn phone!! :D:D(just kiddin ya Dewey!)
Anyway, its looking really good and should be ready for the next player tonight. Just gotta clean it up and pack it.:cool:

Oh and it would be really nice if I knew what address to put on the package??:confused::confused:

[Chris Padilla]

Progress!! Well folks my time with the little box is drawing to a close. As you can see in the picture I have everything fitted and ready for glue up, the box is actually in the clamps right now. I would have had this done last night if Dewey would have let me get off the darn phone!! :D:D(just kiddin ya Dewey!)
Anyway, its looking really good and should be ready for the next player tonight. Just gotta clean it up and pack it.:cool:

Oh and it would be really nice if I knew what address to put on the package??:confused::confused:

Sweet! Is that 1/2" stock for the bottom of the inner box compartment? It looks like solid walnut. Just curious...would like to make my rendering as accurate as possible. I'll try to match your dovetail spacing as well. 7 degree dovetail, I presume?

Who is making the drawer and the top and the bottom? I would guess they are next. Mike has the feet/legs but he also has the curly maple to build the drawer, runners, and bottom and possibly the top.

[Jim Kountz]

Sweet! Is that 1/2" stock for the bottom of the inner box compartment? It looks like solid walnut. Just curious...would like to make my rendering as accurate as possible. I'll try to match your dovetail spacing as well. 7 degree dovetail, I presume?

Who is making the drawer and the top and the bottom? I would guess they are next. Mike has the feet/legs but he also has the curly maple to build the drawer, runners, and bottom and possibly the top.

1/2" solid walnut for the bottom, I had some left over so I just resawed it down and used it. Its floating in the groove but I did fix it in the middle of each end with a dab of glue so it wont shift around. And yes the DT are 7 degree.

Jim Becker:
I have some pieces left over I used for test cuts and can send them to you so you can play around with some finishes. Got your address in the PM you sent.
More pics to come, I actually just came in to get the camera and saw Chris had posted so I thought Id jump on here and reply real quick.

[Jim Kountz]

A few more pics of the box now that its out of the clamps and everything sanded flush. I only took it to 150 on the outside. I couldnt resist seeing what the dovetails looked like so I wet the front and side just for a sneak preview.
I did have a chunk of tearout on one inside corner but Im hoping since we are flocking it and possibly even have some kind of tray, fixed or removable, that it wont be a problem.
Its getting really exciting now, I was just out in the shop and took a moment to pause and just look at it and thinking of the journey its about to embark on. Wondering where it may end up when its all said and done. Im really glad we are doing this and proud to be a part of it.

[Pat Germain]

^^ Sah-weet!

[Dewey Torres]

I think the box goes to Mike from here.

[Dewey Torres]

FYI, I dropped a line to our fellow SMC member Marc Spagnuolo about this collaborative project. He agreed it was interesting and posted a link to this thread on The Wood Whisperer blog. I hope that's OK. :)


Shoot man! I just noticed we are on the front page!!!!


Thanks Marc!

[Larry Edgerton]

Larry,
Can you post a pic of the hinges you have?

I have been working out of town, I'll go up to the shop today and take a picture or two.

[Doug Shepard]

OK guys I need another sanity check. I've gone back to Mike's first sanity check post where he mentioned the 1/2" overhand and tried backing up from there. But I'm missing the reasoning behind that. Is that just because a frame/panel top was abandoned so a top could be put on after the box glue-up? But the real reason for asking is that I'm trying to figure out why we even need a handle if there's a 1/2" built-in finger ledge to lift the top? I can certainly make something but at least the back 1/2" of it is going to have the sight line blocked. With 1-1/4" before the overhang and a handle thickness somewhere around 3/4", that means we get sort of a stairstep thing going on between the handle and overhang separated by a 1/2" gap. I'm having a tough time thinkng of a handle shape that works with that overhang. Make anything deep enough that something is still visible past the overhang and I think you've got something looking like a grafted on wall wart. Keep the depth reasonable and it's not visible past the overhang, and I'm left wondering why bother and why we'd want a handle directly beneath another handle (the overhang).???

The only thing that makes sense to me with the overhang is a top mounted handle which I thought we'd ruled out due to competing with the inlay and carving on the top. I can go back to that though.

I'm happy to make one but are you sure we really want or need one?

[Larry Edgerton]

Here is a hinge in the rough, and some examples of them cut down but not finished. They can even be cut into a heart like the one on a box I made for the lovely Mrs. Edgerton.:)

Species and address?

[Doug Shepard]

Any thought on the earlier handle question?
I did think of one other thing that would avoid the wierd stairstep thing between the handle and overhang that might look OK. That would be to continue the handle partially up the edge of the top. I think it would look better if it was knifed, routed, and let into the edge 1/2", then the protruding 1/4" (or more) on the top edge be shaped somewhat. An alternative would be to rabbet out the back of it by 1/2". If the top were 3/4" thick, I'm thinking maybe run it up the edge 1/2" or so with either of those 2 methods? Still would have to play with some ideas on the shape from the top down, but that would at least kill the stairstep thing.

[Dewey Torres]

Any thought on the earlier handle question?
I did think of one other thing that would avoid the wierd stairstep thing between the handle and overhang that might look OK. That would be to continue the handle partially up the edge of the top. I think it would look better if it was knifed, routed, and let into the edge 1/2", then the protruding 1/4" (or more) on the top edge be shaped somewhat. An alternative would be to rabbet out the back of it by 1/2". If the top were 3/4" thick, I'm thinking maybe run it up the edge 1/2" or so with either of those 2 methods? Still would have to play with some ideas on the shape from the top down, but that would at least kill the stairstep thing.

Doug and all,
When you can get comment from the other box builders and creekers that is great but when the box gets to you often you will notice something that changes your mind. We want each member to impart their own artistry and judgment.

Doug, I agree with you about ditching the stairstep idea. Knifed and routed would be my vote out of what you have posted but I am not trying to marry you to that idea.

The box is packed and will go out to Mike next postal day!

Here we go!

[Chris Padilla]

Doug,

Why not model a few ideas in SU so we can visualize what you are thinking better and we can provide our opinions and thoughts on the matter.

I've posted yet anouther SU file that more closely resembles things. I think I even got Jim's dovetail dimensions pretty close and Mike's ideas for what might be made of maple and the drawer details.

I even added an SMC logo to the bottom of the box.

I'm still working on Mike's legs to get them looking right.

[Dewey Torres]

Doug,

Why not model a few ideas in SU so we can visualize what you are thinking better and we can provide our opinions and thoughts on the matter.

I've posted yet anouther SU file that more closely resembles things. I think I even got Jim's dovetail dimensions pretty close and Mike's ideas for what might be made of maple and the drawer details.

I even added an SMC logo to the bottom of the box.

I'm still working on Mike's legs to get them looking right.


Chris,
You are doing great work. I would still be stuck on the six sided box in SU!

[Doug Shepard]

...Doug and all,
When you can get comment from the other box builders and creekers that is great but when the box gets to you often you will notice something that changes your mind. We want each member to impart their own artistry and judgment.

Doug, I agree with you about ditching the stairstep idea. Knifed and routed would be my vote out of what you have posted but I am not trying to marry you to that idea.

The box is packed and will go out to Mike next postal day!

Here we go!

OK but who is doing the top and at what point does it get attached to the box? From Jim's earlier pics, I dont think thats on what's going to Mike yet is it? For that matter how is the top going to be attached?

[Jeff Nicol]

Jim and Dewey,

I think it has grown to a monster and with the huge outpouring of people willing to put some effort into a collaberation project maybe it could be more than 1. I would be willing to do carving, turning, inside trays or even build another box to start out with. Just a thought and the rewards can be greater. I have made some small books with wooden covers for wedding albums and things so they could be laser engraved with the project and anything else that might be nice to have included in the log book. I think it would be nice to have each contributers hand written notes in the log to prove the fact that many hands were involved. Maybe even a picture with the project in each ones possesion. I know it sounds like lots of paper and things but it would be a living history of the work.

Just my usual rambling!!

Have a great day!!

Jeff

[Chris Padilla]

Box 6 is pretty complete and exploded.

Box 7 is complete and put together (not exploded) and every part has been made a component so it should be much easier to manipulate and move around.

We still have other details to consider:

(1) Hinges
(2) Handles
(3) Laser Engraving
(4) Flocking
(5) Medallions
(6) Figured Panels
(7) Moldings and other edge details

[Doug Shepard]

I'm limited in my SU drawing skills but one shape I've been playing with is a compound curve. I did this with a 1/2 x 1/2 rabbet but if it were let into the edge overhang, the rabbet would be eliminated. I did this using half circles but I think it would have to be shallower with a chord offset from the center more. So roughly a 1/2" projection from the box edge at the top and something like 1-1/2 at the bottom. The height would go to about 3/8" or so from the bottom edge of the lid portion. Dish out the bottom some as well for a finger pull area. I'm not wedded to the shape - just playing with a couple ideas. But I think the this at least illustrates the idea of wrapping this up and over the overhang at the top.

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[mike holden]

Doug,
Sorry, was not available this last weekend to answer your question.
The reason for the 1/2 inch overhang was to balance the overhang from the feet.
Mike

[Chris Padilla]

Doug,
Sorry, was not available this last weekend to answer your question.
The reason for the 1/2 inch overhang was to balance the overhang from the feet.
Mike

Oh yeah, that is true. You know what, I've had a heckuva time getting these feet looking right from your drawing, Mike, and I now see have them backwards from you have done.

Geeez, what a dork I am! :o Every time I try to take your 2-D drawing and 3-D it and wrap it around a corner (mitered), it never looked right. I may need 2 2-D drawings from you to get it right...the one you have provided plus another one 90 degrees turned to capture those details.

I think for now, I will leave these legs as I have had them in the past rendered from your 1 2-D drawing.

[mike holden]

Chris,
the feet look the same from the front and from the side. they are mirror images. the front surface has the shape of an ess or ogee. they mount to the box at the point where the curve stops and the flat begins. to draw an approximation of this curve, draw a straight line between the outer most point of the base flat (in this case 1/8 high and 1/2 outboard) and the bottom corner of the box. then take the midpoint of that line and draw a circular arc to each endpoint. the arc going outboard on the upper part, inboard on the lower part. while this wont get you what I drew, or what will be built, it will be quite close. using midpoints and circular arcs should be a lot simpler. BTW, the crosses in the print of the foot are the centers of the circles I used and the diameters, note that the two surface curves do NOT meet, that is why the above is an approximation.
clear as mud, right?
Mike
BTW, your second pic shows the feet correct in the front view. They will stick out 1/2 inch in front as well. the surface will undulate as an ogee.

[mike holden]

Okay,
Let me explain the drawing I posted earlier, and why the dimensions are what they are.

First, we wanted a box that was small enough to ship around without using a freight truck (grin).

Second, the board was 8 inches wide.

So, classical proportions, a one by one for the side and a golden section for the front, gave us the 8 X 8 side, and the 8 X 12.75 face (8 * 1.6 = 12.8)

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Now, requirements (at the time) for a hidden frame to hold the provenance plank (thanks, Doug) and the feet to the box led to a 1.25 space below the drawer opening. This then was balanced with a 1.25 "cut line" for the top.

The feet were chosen to be 2 inches high to balance the top at 1.25 plus 0.75 thick top panel; 2 to 2

The drawer opening was also 2 inches high

See how this is all tying in together?

The feet have a 0.5 inch overhang, so I drew the top with a 0.5 overhang.

Now for a final check, using the formula found in "The American Vignola A guide to the Making Classical Architecture" by William R. Ware -

"the division of the total height must be into nineteen equal parts, four of which go to the Pedestal, twelve to the column, and three to the Entablature"

Total Height is 10.75 inches therefore 1/19 equals .57 inches

So, "four of which go to the Pedestal" or in this case the feet, 2.26 inches

"twelve to the column" or 6.79 inches

"three to the Entablature" or 1.7 inches

Alright then, we are close with the

Feet 2 inches vs 2.26
box from base to cut line 6.75 vs 6.79
top from cut line up 2 inches vs 1.7

This is very close, and symmetry as well as classical proportions are all close.

Building to simple dimensions has value as well, especially since we are trying to coordinate this build over several people and from coast to coast.

Now, note that I have not drawn any ornamentation save my own ogee feet which were in the original design brief. Proportions really are concerned with masses, not details.

I think that this general proportioning gives us a classic box shape to work from, and hopefully I have explained why the dimensions are as they are.

They are also subject to change based on what each person feels is best for his portion of the project.

But we needed a "jumping-off" point to start.

Mike

[mike holden]

Chris,
I went and took a couple pics of similar feet, hope this helps you visualize them better.
This case was not finished on the back side, our box will be, so all four feet will be like the one on the left in the side view.
Mike

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[Chris Padilla]

Thanks, Mike. I'll see what I can do! :)

[Jim Becker]

Top too thick to my eyes, Chris, unless it's just the viewing angle...

[Chris Padilla]

Top too thick to my eyes, Chris, unless it's just the viewing angle...

The top is currently set at 3/4".

[mike holden]

Jim,
Remember that this is still a placeholder, no edge treatment, no molding beneath (maybe). Heck, no guarantee that it will even overhang the edge.
Mike

[Dewey Torres]

All,
We really have to iron out this lid... I invited Marc Spagnuolo to do it and he agreed and will film it as well.

Marc agreed to cut the lid from the box and fit it. If there is anything additional we want Marc to do, I need to know and fast. I owe him an answer today. Read below:
__________________________________________________ ____________

Count me in my friend. I'll even film my part of the process. So we're just talking releasing the lid from the box and fine tuning the fit? No hinges? Sounds like an hour's worth of fun work!

Thanks so much for including me!

marc

Marc,
Our SMC box build needs one last thing we overlooked... The lid. You have first dibs to accept or decline on it. It will be real easy and will be much less than one day project for you if you want. We kept all tasks small to be easy and not take up time which I am sure you can't find enough of with TWW. All you will have to do is cut it from the box and fit it (anything else you do to it is up to you as the artist) then put it in the mail. If you would like to participate (or not) please let us know.
Dewey Torres

[Doug Shepard]

You guys are killing me with talk of monkeying with that top panel. Makes trying to design any sort of handle a real adventure. Here's something I scribbled together today. I started thinking more of a vertical than horizontal handle and the shape is loosely (very loosely) inspired by the tailpiece on a violin. I also sort of like the idea of having that front overhang edge notched out completely and the handle projecting 1/4" above the top. I've got a number of guidelines on the pic to show where the the top plane of the lid, the lid thickness, and overhang depth would lie.
Anyway - just one more random set of noodlings.
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[Jim Kountz]

All,
We really have to iron out this lid... I invited Marc Spagnuolo to do it and he agreed and will film it as well.

Marc agreed to cut the lid from the box and fit it. If there is anything additional we want Marc to do, I need to know and fast. I owe him an answer today. Read below:
__________________________________________________ ____________

Count me in my friend. I'll even film my part of the process. So we're just talking releasing the lid from the box and fine tuning the fit? No hinges? Sounds like an hour's worth of fun work!

Thanks so much for including me!

marc

Marc,
Our SMC box build needs one last thing we overlooked... The lid. You have first dibs to accept or decline on it. It will be real easy and will be much less than one day project for you if you want. We kept all tasks small to be easy and not take up time which I am sure you can't find enough of with TWW. All you will have to do is cut it from the box and fit it (anything else you do to it is up to you as the artist) then put it in the mail. If you would like to participate (or not) please let us know.
Dewey Torres

Since Marc is cutting the top of the box he should go ahead and mount the maple board and give it any edge treatment that its going to get. I vote for some classical form, ogee or something of that sort to complement Mikes feet. Hey Mike nice feet you have!! :D:D Then he can fit the assembly back to the box and send it along to the next guy.

[mike holden]

This is great!
Will he mount the hinges as well?
Cut the lid off, mount the top, and mount the hinges?

Who is making the top?

Dewey, I think you need to coordinate that area of the box.

Spoke with Doug tonite and we are anxiously awaiting the arrival.

Mike
"The Leg Man"

[Jim Kountz]

This is great!
Will he mount the hinges as well?
Cut the lid off, mount the top, and mount the hinges?

Who is making the top?

Dewey, I think you need to coordinate that area of the box.

Spoke with Doug tonite and we are anxiously awaiting the arrival.

Mike
"The Leg Man"
Mike see my post above, Marc will cut the top of the box, mount the maple to that and fit it. It makes sense to me that he also do any edge treatment to the lid as well.
Unfortunately my UPS store was closed today for Presidents Day so the box will be delayed until tomorrow, sorry guys!! Blame George and Abe!!

[mike holden]

Dewey,
I think we need to add Marc's name to the "Provenance Plank".
Since you did the original artwork on that, would you please?
and post it so Chris can add it to the sketchup file.
Thanks,
Mike

[Dewey Torres]

Dewey,
I think we need to add Marc's name to the "Provenance Plank".
Since you did the original artwork on that, would you please?
and post it so Chris can add it to the sketchup file.
Thanks,
Mike

Already in the works!

[Jim Kountz]

The box is on its way! It was shipped out today so the journey has begun. I did take one last picture of it, with me. The big green blob with the hat is me, the pretty box is the other one in the pic!:D:D

[Dewey Torres]

Well,
Boy Howdy she is off. Now lets all tune in to thewoodwhisperer
and watch it all start to unfold.

[Chris Padilla]

This is great!
Will he mount the hinges as well?
Cut the lid off, mount the top, and mount the hinges?

Who is making the top?

Dewey, I think you need to coordinate that area of the box.

Spoke with Doug tonite and we are anxiously awaiting the arrival.

Mike
"The Leg Man"

Mike,

I kinda thought you would handle the lid and make it from that chunk of curly maple you got. Do you have enough?

[mike holden]

Chris,
Do now! went and bought a second plank today.
Mike

[Chris Padilla]

Mike,

Excellent...hope I didn't coerce you into this! :o

So as I understand it, curly maple pieces on the box will be:

(1) Lid
(2) 4 Legs
(3) Provenance Plaque (i.e. the bottom)
(4) Drawer carcass (not sure...3 pieces...walnut will be the front?)

Further, all these pieces are being supplied by Mike.

Am I close? :)

What is happening with the lid? Recall I had a large inlay of crotch walnut (on the jewelry box) and so I wondered if anything like that was in the cards for this box?

Since I'm not doing anything physical to this box, I do have some very figured/spalted maple that might work if this idea fits this box. I can either supply the maple or do it myself. I guess all I would need is the lid.

Thoughts?

[Dewey Torres]

Chris,
Do now! went and bought a second plank today.
Mike


Well that explains why you took "The Leg Man" tag down

[Ed Sallee]

Jim - the box looks great! I love Walnut and the grain on the wood you selected is awesome.....

Not sure if it's even needed, and you probably already did this... but, I thought I'd throw a tip out there for some of our readers.... And, the box is at the point where this just might be a good tip...

When I make a box, I always run through the grains of sandpaper doing this. I use craft glue (spray) in a can to glue sheets of sandpaper to a piece of plywood.... It provides for a very flat, clean, sanded surface for the top and the bottom to join. Using a power tool will tend to cause dips and uneven surfaces....

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn88/evsallee/9.jpg

Sorry, I haven't been posting much on here lately as I've had my hands full down in the shop.....

[mike holden]

Chris,
Yes, you are correct. Walnut front on the drawer.

Milled up the stock today.

Started with some resawing for the thinner pieces, drawer sides, bottom, provenance plank.

110747

110748

110749

[mike holden]

Flattened the top plank and sprung the joint

110750

Note the shavings from the curved blade

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[mike holden]

Here is all the bits and pieces ready for shaping

110752

From the left, what will be drawer sides, the frame pieces, the top, the feet, and the provenance plank.

Sharp eyes and minds will discover some additional material - watch this space for further developments (grin)

And this is all that is left from two boards 6" X 72"

110753

I will start now on gluing the top panel and it will be ready for the next person. Then shape the feet and assemble. Then shape the frame.

Then I need the box to start fitting things.

Mike

[mike holden]

Okay Everyone!

This is just a teaser, but these feet are so *CUTE!*

Still need to be completed, but boy are they coming along nicely!

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110987

Mike

"the leg man"

[Dewey Torres]

Mike...

Love em!

You seem to be taking names here!

[Dewey Torres]

Doug,
I like your idea but I think you need to slim it down some. It looks a touch bulky on the drawings "too me".

Hey, I may be completely wrong what do you all think???

Doug...you are a better WW than me so just use your judgment when you see / feel the box ok?

[Jim Kountz]

Wow I havent been on here to check the progress and when I did.......WOW!! Doug and Mike have been some very busy fellows!!
Doug, looks like you have a "handle" on things!! LOL (couldnt resist) And Mike those feet are just way too cool man!! According to the UPS tracking site Marc should have the box tomorrow so hopefully we'll soon see some more progress with his end of things. I bet you two guys are chompin at the bit, I know I would be!!

[Jim Kountz]

Jim - the box looks great! I love Walnut and the grain on the wood you selected is awesome.....

Not sure if it's even needed, and you probably already did this... but, I thought I'd throw a tip out there for some of our readers.... And, the box is at the point where this just might be a good tip...

When I make a box, I always run through the grains of sandpaper doing this. I use craft glue (spray) in a can to glue sheets of sandpaper to a piece of plywood.... It provides for a very flat, clean, sanded surface for the top and the bottom to join. Using a power tool will tend to cause dips and uneven surfaces....

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn88/evsallee/9.jpg

Sorry, I haven't been posting much on here lately as I've had my hands full down in the shop.....

Hey Ed, Im actually not cutting the top off, Marc is but I think you make a good point in that this is something of interest for everyone to follow along with in case they have never done this. I do exactly as you described here except I have an old piece of marble from a counter top I use. Same theory though, flatten the two surfaces so they meet with no gap. This is a great project!!

[Doug Shepard]

Doug,
I like your idea but I think you need to slim it down some. It looks a touch bulky on the drawings "too me".

Hey, I may be completely wrong what do you all think???
...

Width or depth? I did slim the depth down quite a bit already, but here's a couple of the considerations I had that put me where I'm at with the pic I emailed.
I started at the point where you would grip it with thumb and index finger and sort of worked backward from there. Too shallow and there's not much of a grip area, but with the slope, that does cause it to be deeper at the top. The width was part of the consideration at that grip area too - at the base of the top portion it's only about 1.5". But I also partly based the width on how much wood I felt ought to be surrounding the holes for the rare earth mags, and for the dowel attaching holes on the back. I can try scaling it down some, but I'm not sure how much manouvering room I've got with some of those competing issues.

The rest of you are probably going: What drawing?
I sent a couple things via email just to avoid the pesky pic resizing dance.

111089111090

[Chris Padilla]

Doug,

I like the handle/medallion you've got going although it does look a little big to my eye. What I really think is going to happen is that the box will be opened by grabing both sides of the lid (due to the overhang).

What your handle/medallion may do is keep the lid shut via magnets. I'm not sure what the two small "dots" on the large, right side pic are but I immediately thought "magnets" and then thought it might be a great idea.

What will determine how the box is opened is two-fold:

(1) How heavy is the box and
(2) can it overcome the strength of the magnets (assuming there are any)?

Assuming Magnets
==============
If there is a lot of stuff in the drawer, opening the lid by grabing either side of the overhanged lid may be enough. If it isn't heavy enough, one may grab the lid and grab the lower handle and then pull up to open or one may grab the upper and lower handle to open the box.

Assuming no latching/closing mechanism
==============================
I don't think the hinges we chose wil prevent accidental/sudden opening of the lid. Is there something that will minimize snaps open and/or closed? Magnets will keep it closed but not prevent slamming shut. Do we need something to minimize the lid opening too far?

We haven't really discussed any box hardware yet....

[Doug Shepard]

Chris/Dewey
I scaled this down as far as I dare and have this form still viable. BTW I'm referring to this as the Violin Tailpiece rather than a medalion. I stole the form loosely from something I saw on the Stew-Mac site. I posted a draft drawing of the top portion but after talking with Mike last week he convinced me to go back to a 2 piece design that I had originally floated several weeks ago That also allowed resurrecting the rare earth mags between the halves. Tentatively those are planned as 3/16" diam x 3/8" tall (2 in each half). I also picked up some 1/4" but those were iffy even before downsizing.
Anyway, I think this is about the limit of how far I can push this form. I also dont show ther cut line moved to it's new lower position yet either - I just scaled everything.
---------------------------------------------
111122111123

1-9/16 deep at top vs 1-3/4 (1/2" let into overhang)
1-1/8 depth at the split point vs 1-7/16
57/64 deep ar bottom end vs 1"
3-33/64 overall height vs 4"
1/8" protruding above the lid vs 1/4"

If I push it any further I get this
111124
The bottom portion is too small to get both holes for the magnets and 2 dowel attaching holes without making a fragile piece of swiss cheese. The top face also looks like a mistake rather than a design feature. I decided a week or so ago that rather than try to work around the lid overhang, I'd be better off going right through it and advertising it. This makes it look like I tried to go flush and missed. If I actually make it flush, any wood movement in either piece results in the same appearance of a mistake.

Chris:
What I really think is going to happen is that the box will be opened by grabing both sides of the lid (due to the overhang).
Hmmm. Deja Vu all over again.

OK guys I need another sanity check.... But the real reason for asking is that I'm trying to figure out why we even need a handle if there's a 1/2" built-in finger ledge to lift the top? I can certainly make something but at least the back 1/2" of it is going to have the sight line blocked. With 1-1/4" before the overhang and a handle thickness somewhere around 3/4", that means we get sort of a stairstep thing going on between the handle and overhang separated by a 1/2" gap. I'm having a tough time thinkng of a handle shape that works with that overhang. Make anything deep enough that something is still visible past the overhang and I think you've got something looking like a grafted on wall wart. Keep the depth reasonable and it's not visible past the overhang, and I'm left wondering why bother and why we'd want a handle directly beneath another handle (the overhang).???
...
I'm happy to make one but are you sure we really want or need one?

Edit: The stairstep type comments on that earlier post were when I was still trying to figure out something in a horizontal 1 piece handle.

[Chris Padilla]

Doug,

Can you post the SU file for your handle? If it is too large, just zip it up.

Thanks....

[Marc Spagnuolo]

Hey guys. Just wanted to let you all know that the box arrived today and I have already released the top. Who's next on the list?

Everything went really well. I used the tablesaw with my thinnest kerf blade (not all that thin, lol). I used blue tape to ensure a clean cut all around, and I even added small kerf-width shims to keep everything together nicely during the cuts.

After the cut, I had a little burning to clean off but that was about it. No major corrections needed to be made, thankfully.

Since I would guess that most other folks working on this project live in more humid areas than I do (Arizona), I wanted to get this done and outta here before the wood decides to do something wacky. :)

Thanks for allowing me to participate in the collaboration. I am honored to be a part of it. I did film it and should have a quick little video posted on my site soon.

Good luck!

[mike holden]

Marc,
I think I am next on the list to put the feet on the box. Doug Shepherd lives near me and will be doing the handle for the top.
I will PM you with my address.
Mike

[Chris Padilla]

Nice work, Marc!! Thanks for your thoughtful cut! :D

Now onto Mike for some CURLY MAPLE action! :D

[Doug Shepard]

Doug,

Can you post the SU file for your handle? If it is too large, just zip it up.

Thanks....

You want the unscaled one or the scaled down one? If you want the scaled down one, the only SU model with that is attached to your box7 file though it's in separate components. Lemme know. I'll be here for a while but I may be trying to see about lining up a ride to the hospital tonight or for sure tomorrow AM to the doc. Not too sure but I think I broke my leg or hip this afternoon. So if I disappear for a bit that's why.

[Jim Kountz]

Cool Marc, this is getting very exciting now. Glad the box arrived ok and that everything went well, now on to Mike "the leg man" Holden!!

[Jim Kountz]

You want the unscaled one or the scaled down one? If you want the scaled down one, the only SU model with that is attached to your box7 file though it's in separate components. Lemme know. I'll be here for a while but I may be trying to see about lining up a ride to the hospital tonight or for sure tomorrow AM to the doc. Not too sure but I think I broke my leg or hip this afternoon. So if I disappear for a bit that's why.

What?? Doug!! Man are you ok? I sure hope you didnt break anything that sounds horrible!! If you think you did that kind of damage you NEED to get to the hospital tonight dont sleep on that thing if its broke you could do more damage to it. Wow, keep us posted ok??

[Chris Padilla]

You want the unscaled one or the scaled down one? If you want the scaled down one, the only SU model with that is attached to your box7 file though it's in separate components. Lemme know. I'll be here for a while but I may be trying to see about lining up a ride to the hospital tonight or for sure tomorrow AM to the doc. Not too sure but I think I broke my leg or hip this afternoon. So if I disappear for a bit that's why.

I hope you're okay...post whatever you have! :)

[Doug Shepard]

Chris
I cant get the scaled one with the box zipped small enough to pass the upload limit. PM me your email addr if yu want that one too.

Never had a broken bone before other than a toe but I think that's what's going on. I can't put any weight at all on my right leg. I've got a cane from years ago when I had some walking trouble after back surgery and I'm able to get around slowly with that. I lost an argument with my driveway and slipped. Came down pretty hard mostly on my hip. The knee hurts the worst but I'm able to kneel on it sort of OK, Standing and walking is real tough though and hurts mostly in the hip area. The whole legs smarts from the hip down to my shin so the trouble could be anywhere though. I'll let you know what I find out tomorrow.

111212

[Dewey Torres]

Chris
I cant get the scaled one with the box zipped small enough to pass the upload limit. PM me your email addr if yu want that one too.

Never had a broken bone before other than a toe but I think that's what's going on. I can't put any weight at all on my right leg. I've got a cane from years ago when I had some walking trouble after back surgery and I'm able to get around slowly with that. I lost an argument with my driveway and slipped. Came down pretty hard mostly on my hip. The knee hurts the worst but I'm able to kneel on it sort of OK, Standing and walking is real tough though and hurts mostly in the hip area. The whole legs smarts from the hip down to my shin so the trouble could be anywhere though. I'll let you know what I find out tomorrow.

111212

Doug,
Sorry to hear that. You will be in our prayers.

[Pat Germain]

I just saw a preview of Marc's video for slicing off the top of the box. (Dewey, he drops your name, dude!)

It's a short video, but it's interesting how Marc approached this seemingly simple task. He took many precautions to ensure a clean, straight cut and removing minimal amounts of wood.

The video should be posted to The Wood Whisperer site tomorrow or Thursday.

[Larry Edgerton]

Doug.

I have broken 62 bones, and if your leg is broken it will hurt badly with no weight on it as well, especially in the first 24 hours,so maybe there is hope that it is just a bruise. A break usually gives you enough pain at rest that there is no question about getting help.

Get it checked out and let us know, wish you the best. Michigan is not really a good place in the winter as we get older.....

Larry

[Doug Shepard]

Larry
It does hurt some at rest too but I had some good music last night: Help Me Make It Through the Night by Vic O. Din:D No change from yesterday though.
I should be heading to the hospital in an hour or so to check it out. I'm wondering if I might have just dislocated a few things since there's no visible bruising, swelling, or any obvious wierd angled parts. I've been doing some checking this morning just in case I find myself stuck in the hospital and it looks like they might have WiFi access so I might be able to stay connected at least.

[mike holden]

Doug,
Get Well Soonest!
Put getting well at the top of your list.

Will contact you when the box arrives.

Mike
"the leg man"

[Larry Edgerton]

So whats up Doug!

Curious minds need to know!

[Doug Shepard]

I got back from the hospital a couple hours ago, but curled up with a couple Vicodin and Motrin and checked out for a while. After about 20 xrays of hip, lower lumber, leg, and knee, they informed me that nothing is broken (still feels broken to me). They showed some degenerate bone disease in the hip area and figured I just bruised the bones pretty good and that it's not bouncing back very well due to the bone disease.
They figure I can look forward to hip replacement surgery somewhere in the future. So I'm supposed to stay off it through this weekend and sent me home with an Rx for vicodin and motrin and I need to follow up with my regular doc. So at least no cast, no surgery, but no real improvement yet either though the drugs definitely help.

[Larry Edgerton]

The Dow motto: A better life through chemicals!

I remember the Vicodin and the Percodans and the Darvocets, but just vaguely.:)

Glad you are just bruised, but I know that is of no help to you now. A bruised bone is painful, especially as we get older. Bones swell, did you know that? I was amazed when they told me that. How old are you buddy, or should I call you Sir!

Wish I lived closer, I'd bring around a bottle of Glenfidich......

Best to you.

Larry

[Dewey Torres]

We are on the front page...see the video on TWW:

http://thewoodwhisperer.com/

[mike holden]

Ogee Bracket Feet

111390

Ogee bracket feet are a stylish version of the flat bracket foot. They add some curve and can balance out the moldings at the top of the case. They also are mounted to a frame with an additional mold that can hide the raw edge of the carcase (usually).

But the very shape makes one wonder how to make them. For larger feet, one can make the feet flat surfaced and bandsaw out the ogee shape. But for smaller feet, this is impractical.

One should start with the design. Some things to note: The upper curve is usually a larger radius than the lower, although they approach being the same as the foot gets smaller (and vice versa). The back of the lower curve is usually a mirror image of the front – the illusion is of a straight foot that is bending under the load. The very bottom of the foot is vertical, this is to prevent having a fragile edge that would soon deteriorate. The curves along the back usually contain segments of a circle, this is for ease of construction.

Start designing by deciding on the size of the foot. In this case, I have chosen a 1 ½’ high by 2’ wide foot.

111391

Starting at the bottom, I set out an 1/8” base. Then, using a circle template, played with the front curve till I liked the shape. I tried to use a standard size circle, and marked the center as well. This allows for use of standard router bits to mold the front curve. The back side of the front curve was marked with a matching arc to the front, and smaller circles were used to create the arcs sweeping up to the top. Centers for these were marked out as well.

At this point, I make sure I have the router bits for the front curve, and if I don’t, then I either redesign to match the bits I have or purchase the bits needed. In this case, a ½” roundover and a 1” corebox bit.

Now, I make templates; one of the shape, and one of the circle centers.

111392

I make the templates from acetate, this is an old patternmakers trick, the acetate when scored with a knife or scriber, will fracture along the line when bent.

111393

I have outlined the templates with magic marker for the pictures, it is not necessary for use. Note that I have marked the orientation of the hole center pattern with arrows. The hole centers were marked with a centerpunch.

Mill your wood. The height is simple, 1 ½”; the depth is the maximum you can get from your board, in this case 0.800”, and the length is the width of the foot, times two, plus an allowance for two saw kerfs, with my saw – about ¼” so 4 ¼”, times the number of feet (4) for a total of 17” plus 3 saw kerfs. I made my blank 26” long as that was the length of the board I was cutting it from.

[mike holden]

Now to mold the face. Start by marking off the waste area, using your template.

111394

Verify that your router bits are the correct sizes

111395

111396

Cut the cove first so you have the maximum supporting face on your router table.
Then cut the roundover.

111397

[mike holden]

Next we need to blend the two curves together.
Start by using the edge of a pencil to mark the point where the roundover meets the flat. This is the upper limit of your blending.

111398

You can use a block plane to get the majority of the waste off, then finish up with sandpaper.

111399

When you are done you should still be able to see your pencil line, and the two curves should merge smoothly.

111400

111401

Next is to cut the molded length into pair segments, in this case the 4 ¼” lengths. Because I am a worry wart, I made two extra sets.

111402

[mike holden]

Now to make the 45° angles for the miter joint. I use a purpose made sled for this operation. It allows me to clamp the part in place and make the cut with my fingers safely away from the blade. I also push the part through the blade, but not across the back, and then stop the saw, and when the blade stops bring the sled back and remove the part.

111403

111404

The back of each blank is numbered 1A and 1B, 2A and 2B, etc so that the grain will flow around the joint. Subtle point, but it is easily done, and really impresses those who notice. The blank is flipped end for end for the second cut.

Now to layout the location and height of the spline. The two requirements are: 1) do not go past the “break” point where the roundover meets the top, and 2) leave some glue space in the miter behind the spline. With a foot this small, this is leaves a small area in which to place the spline.


111405

This cut is made using the other side of the sled.

111406

111407

[mike holden]

Cut some splines from thin plywood and voila!

111408

Now we drill the tight curves in the shape. Using a simple jig and our template, we setup the drill press.

111409

A note about drilling the holes, since the holes are siamesed and are cut into a molded surface, you will need to use a forstner bit. Also, since you will be leaving a thin section of wood, it is best to drill the left side hole first. This allows the most material backing up the grain on the point, the right side will tend to push the grain into itself. This means that there are four drill setups not two.

111410

Using the template, you now layout the remaining curves and using either a bandsaw or a scrollsaw, finish the shaping

111411

I started by establishing the base cut, then came through the waste into the holes, and came from the holes back down to the base, and from the holes to the top.

[mike holden]

Now apply glue and splines and assemble. Allow to dry.

111412

Use rasps and/or files to clean up the saw marks and blend in where the spline poked through.

111413

Note that the siamesed holes leave a very fragile edge. I file it back from the outside. You can also see how the spline pokes through and needs to be knocked back into line.

Now a little light sanding, and you are done!

111414

[Chris Padilla]

Thanks for the mini-tutorial, Mike! Very nice work. Now that I see how they are built, it might actually help me get it right in SU. If you don't need the spare, maybe you could send it to me? :D

[Doug Shepard]

OK guys. I guess I've decided to go with this.
I hope it's not Vicodin influenced. It's basically the same general profile as the one I put on post #176 but with the depth squashed, then widened to allow more room for the finger recess.
Finger recess 3/4 x 1-1/2 x 5/8 deep
Knob footprint 2-1/4 x 3 x 7/8 deep
111625
111626111627
No magnets (unless stuck in the box face edges), and straight lines going through the overhang notch.
111628

[Jim Kountz]

Mike thats one nice tutorial on bracket feet, thanks for taking the time to do this!!
Doug glad to hear nothing was broke, hope you heal soon buddy!!

[Doug Shepard]

Well it just dawned on me today what my med problem is and it's not the leg at all. I couldn't understand how falling on my hip and leg would cause all the pain in my hip, leg, knee, shin, and occasionally even my foot. This will be my 3rd time but I'm sure I've ruptured another disc and it's putting pressure on the sciatica (sp?) nerve. I didn't think of this as I dont really have any pain in the back this time and I didn't fall on my back either. But it explains an awful lot. Like why nothing showed up on the Xrays while I was sure i must have broken something. It also explains the severe pain in the entire leg while only landing on the hip/leg area. I'm not sure how I managed to rupture a disc falling on my side but I'm sure that's what it is. Lucky me.
I'm going to call my doc first thing Monday AM and try to get the cat scan set up ASAP.

[Chris Padilla]

Doug,

Just take care of yourself...don't sweat this project. We'll figure something out. :)

[Bill Wyko]

Other Ideas:

LASER COMMUNITY

Why don’t we involve the Laser folks to put all of our names on the box bottom just before the finish? Thoughts?

HINGE MAKERS:
Any folks who can do wooden hinges?

LID HANDLE:
I know of some Creekers that are very good at these, some who even have stickies on hand made ones.

THE GUTS:
Anyone want to tackle the inside? Lift outs? Flocking? Other?

THE ONLINE CONTRIBUTORS:
For all those who are not able to participate in the hands on portion, you can still contribute your design ideas but we need them before the construction starts. Extended of course, to this crowd it "what to do / sell / the final product". Putting together the raffle, advertizing, etc.

All participants who need my contact info please PM. Some of you already have it.


I'll be building wooden hinges tomorrow. Do you still need them? What kind of wood would you like em in.:D I have lots of curly maple, a little Bubinga, shedua, rosewood and some others. Do you need any veneers?

[Doug Shepard]

Chris
I actually think there's only brief jointing and TS steps that are needed and I can stand for those (standing is much better than walking). I think the rest is largely do-able sitting down and I can get help moving or setting tools up if need be. I didn't have any plan until yesterday. I've sure got the time off tho I may not be able to work up to my normal glacial speed. I think I can manage to lift this massive project:D. If I end up going into the hospital for some chisel work that's another matter, but let me take a whack at it before deciding it's beyond my ability.

[Bill Wyko]

I'm building wooden hinges tomorrow. Need some? Need any Maple veneer?

[Doug Shepard]

I've been lookin at the backside of my handle design and I'm not sure how to attach this. 2 Dowels at the bottom are simple enough. But the space left over for 1 or 2 more at the top is rather tight.
Above the finger recess, there's only 3/8" of the lid left where is might be possible to use a biscuit. To either side of the recess there's only 43/64" left. Using 1/4" dowels only leaves around 1/8" between the dowels hole and end point or finger recess. Use smaller dowel at those 2 points or deal with having to get a biscuit slot inside the notched lid overhang?
111730

[Chris Padilla]

I'm building wooden hinges tomorrow. Need some? Need any Maple veneer?

Bill,

Someone on here was doing hinges. I know the theread is MASSIVE, but I believe we have that covered...but maybe not?! :)

[Belton Garvin]

Jim,
Chris brings up a good point. For those of us that haven't been involved since the beginning, could you put a summary on the first post of who is doing what? I, for one would love to know if it is coming near Virginia Beach. I would love to drop by someones place and get a first hand look at how it's coming along, even though I'm not directly involved in the construction. Just a thought. Looks great so far.

Bear

[Dewey Torres]

Jim,
Chris brings up a good point. For those of us that haven't been involved since the beginning, could you put a summary on the first post of who is doing what? I, for one would love to know if it is coming near Virginia Beach. I would love to drop by someones place and get a first hand look at how it's coming along, even though I'm not directly involved in the construction. Just a thought. Looks great so far.

Bear

Belton,
You are in luck. It is coming to Hayes, VA where Keith Outten, (the owner of Sawmill Creek), will put a CNC carving on it. Go to my album and click on the map of the USA. It has all the players execpt I need to add Marc.

[Mike McCann]

I just saw the box on the wood whispers site. Looking good so far. He just cut the top portion off.

[Glen Dion]

If I may provide a surprise gift for inside the box, will that qualify me as a contributor? Either way, I'd like to do that since my time is at a premium these days. So if I may get the dimensions at some point I can simply send it off to Jim or whom ever is going to be the final handler.

Glen

[Larry Edgerton]

I've been lookin at the backside of my handle design and I'm not sure how to attach this. 2 Dowels at the bottom are simple enough. But the space left over for 1 or 2 more at the top is rather tight.
Above the finger recess, there's only 3/8" of the lid left where is might be possible to use a biscuit. To either side of the recess there's only 43/64" left. Using 1/4" dowels only leaves around 1/8" between the dowels hole and end point or finger recess. Use smaller dowel at those 2 points or deal with having to get a biscuit slot inside the notched lid overhang?
111730

Doug, It may look good if the hinges matched the shape of the latch. I dont think they should contrast but the shape could be the same or complimentary.

I can send some down if you would like to play with that idea. Just cut some and hot melt them on to see how it flows.

Gotta get to work.......

[Glen Dion]

Or not.
Okay, bad idea.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Doug,

What wood are using to make the handle? Do you think you and I should use the same kind of wood so it will look like a coordinated effort?

[Doug Shepard]

Ken
I was going to use curly mango with ebony trim, but...

Guys
I need to be realistic and think I'm going to have to pull out of this project. Sorry for the late decision. I thought maybe I could hang in there long enough to get this done with a bit of help. But my med problems are getting increasingly worse. I'm not really even in a position now to stand for brief periods. The preliminary MRI results that my doc got from the radiologist and a nuerosurgeon colleague (not the one I told my doc I would be using if it came to that) are that I have "a number of questionable discs". I'm not sure what that means but the next stop is with my nuerosurgeon. The hip pain is excruciating and so far the meds thay've had me on aren't doing that much to relieve it. On top of that, I'm getting swelling developing in the foot, ankle, and calf and only realized yesterday that they didn't look at that area on the initial ER Xrays or the MRI this week. Both my soon-to-be Ex-Primary Care Doctor and the hospital have dropped the ball on me in more ways than i care to go into, but I think I'm headed to another hospital's ER clinic today to have the foot/ankle/calf looked at to make sure there's not a break there in addition to whatever disc problems that might be causing the sciatic nerve pain through the hip.

I wish you all well on this, but I just dont see how I'm going to be able to stay involved in this at the moment.

[Dewey Torres]

Ken
I was going to use curly mango with ebony trim, but...

Guys
I need to be realistic and think I'm going to have to pull out of this project. Sorry for the late decision. I thought maybe I could hang in there long enough to get this done with a bit of help. But my med problems are getting increasingly worse. I'm not really even in a position now to stand for brief periods. The preliminary MRI results that my doc got from the radiologist and a nuerosurgeon colleague (not the one I told my doc I would be using if it came to that) are that I have "a number of questionable discs". I'm not sure what that means but the next stop is with my nuerosurgeon. The hip pain is excruciating and so far the meds thay've had me on aren't doing that much to relieve it. On top of that, I'm getting swelling developing in the foot, ankle, and calf and only realized yesterday that they didn't look at that area on the initial ER Xrays or the MRI this week. Both my soon-to-be Ex-Primary Care Doctor and the hospital have dropped the ball on me in more ways than i care to go into, but I think I'm headed to another hospital's ER clinic today to have the foot/ankle/calf looked at to make sure there's not a break there in addition to whatever disc problems that might be causing the sciatic nerve pain through the hip.

I wish you all well on this, but I just dont see how I'm going to be able to stay involved in this at the moment.

That's ok Doug. Just heal up and be well. You back is something that should take priority.

[Belton Garvin]

If you need someone to step in for Doug, just let me know. I know you guys are working hard to coordinate this effort and replacing/adding someone at this point may make things more difficult. I would love to help out where I can. Just let me know.

Bear

[Dewey Torres]

If you need someone to step in for Doug, just let me know. I know you guys are working hard to coordinate this effort and replacing/adding someone at this point may make things more difficult. I would love to help out where I can. Just let me know.

Bear

Belton,
You are in!
PM me your address ASAP

[Jim Kountz]

Wow I just got a chance to check in here as I was out of town all weekend. Doug!! Im sorry to hear you're not going to be able to do this, hope you heal soon and get back to your old self again. I think if we ever do another one you will get top honors of picking any part you want to do ok?

Belton, welcome aboard, looking forward to seeing you ideas!!

Dewey, thanks for holding down the fort while I was off playing this weekend.

[Doug Shepard]

If you need someone to step in for Doug, just let me know. I know you guys are working hard to coordinate this effort and replacing/adding someone at this point may make things more difficult. I would love to help out where I can. Just let me know.

Bear

Nice to have you warmed up in the bullpen:D

I'll be watching the game from the sidelines while you guys have all the fun.

[Belton Garvin]

Thanks for the warm welcome everyone. I'm going to take a couple days to go through some ideas. I really like the design Doug worked on, we'll see what I can come up with.
Doug, hang in there man, take care of yourself.

Bear

[Belton Garvin]

Alright, I went through all the 250+ posts a little closer this time to make sure I'm up to speed. I need to know a couple things in particular:

1. Is the lid made yet? If it is, what kind of edge treatment has been applied or going to be applied?

2. Where am I on the list to get the box?

I've got a couple ideas but they really depend on the edge treatment of the lid for final details and selection. I've got a nice piece of spalted Maple burl that will look good with the curly maple top. I still plan on using Doug's idea of wrapping it with ebony to set it apart.

Ken, does this work with what you plan with the knobs? If not I can change the burl to something more convenient for you. If we want more contrast I can do that too. Just let me know.

[Chris Padilla]

Belton,

Any luck with SU? It would be very cool if you could mock things up in there.

[Belton Garvin]

Here is what I came up with for the handle. Let me know what you guys think and I'll see if I can make the changes. Overall dimensions are 2" H (flush with top) 2 15/16 W. The one without the lip is 3/4" deep at the top and 5/16 deep at the bottom extending outside the top by 1/4" The second one with the ebony lip, the lip extends 1/4" and the underside is flush with lid and angled back to 5/16". I hope that's not to confusing trying to explain it.

By the way...Sketchup is a great program! Just wish I knew what I was doing with it...that was way more painful to draw than it needed to be.

[Dewey Torres]

Here is what I came up with for the handle. Let me know what you guys think and I'll see if I can make the changes. Overall dimensions are 2" H (flush with top) 2 15/16 W. The one without the lip is 3/4" deep at the top and 5/16 deep at the bottom extending outside the top by 1/4" The second one with the ebony lip, the lip extends 1/4" and the underside is flush with lid and angled back to 5/16". I hope that's not to confusing trying to explain it.

By the way...Sketchup is a great program! Just wish I knew what I was doing with it...that was way more painful to draw than it needed to be.

Are those lines meaning individual pieces?

[Belton Garvin]

Sorry, forgot that part. The black lines are 1/16" Ebony (or Blackwood) and the other is 1/2" Maple Burl. The one with the lip has 1/4" Ebony for the top piece.

[Belton Garvin]

Here are the sketchup files if anyone is interested.

[Belton Garvin]

I did some thinking last night and thought Bloodwood would also look good instead of ebony. Changed the color in the pics below.

[Chris Padilla]

Belton, I think you're doing just great with SU! You just have to use it...and you will eventually figure it out.

I'm still concerned if the "handle" needs to be locking at all. Magnets?

[Belton Garvin]

I probably couldn't incorporate a latch or magnet into the actual handle as designed. We could go with a Humidor latch (http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=585) like this one or we could go with magnets on the ledge of the box and lid. That's up to everyone to decide if we want to go that route. If you guys want me to install either just let me know. Someone else could easily install either also.

[mike holden]

Belton,
Welcome Aboard!
I currently have possession of the box, but am recovering from emergency surgery so progress will be slow for a bit.
I have the feet done, and the maple bits roughed out, including the top.

Not sure who is responsible for the top, but during my time in the hospital, I did a few sketches of possible edge treatments/moldings that would tie in the various latches proposed.

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These are non-traditional edge treatments whose purpose was to tie the shapes together.

As a more traditional form:

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Using an ovolo and a cyma reversa on the top panel with a cyma recta on the lower molding is one suggestion.

There seems to be a direction of staying somewhat period on this piece, and so would offer the following for some guidance: (from How to Design and Construct Period Furniture by F.H. Gottshall)

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112810

This may help with further suggestions.

[Jim Kountz]

My vote would be for the one on the far right in the first picture.
Mike they wouldnt let you bring in a few hand tools while you were laid up?? LOL

[Dewey Torres]

Mike,
Those are some great sketches and I hope you are recovering well.

I like number 2.

Be well and don't rush it!

[Jim Kountz]

Well guys I got some bad news from St. Judes. Apparently they are not interested in our project. I got an email from them and to sum it up they said this:

" After careful evaluation, we have concluded that your proposal is outside the scope of St. Jude’s current means of support."

So Im not sure what this means exactly other than they dont want to participate so after talking it over with my partner in crime Dewey we have decided to go with the next choice which would be Habitat For Humanity. As you may recall they were the runner up in the poll to choose a charity.
I really didnt ask much of St Judes at all just a mention or something on their website and was told they couldnt or wouldnt do that. I told them we would give ALL the proceeds 100% to them. So go figure.

So thats where we are with that and I will keep you all updated as the details come in. Meanwhile its back to business as usual!!

[Belton Garvin]

Mike,
I looked over the pages you attached and noticed a profile that l liked. (attached below) It's a little blurry but you get the idea. Early on I noticed there was some concern of the thickness of the top, with this profile you keep the thickness but it appears thinner. If I had to pick a profile from your first drawing I would go with the 3rd (far right).

I'll try and come up with a handle design that fits with those types of designs. I'm not sure what direction I'm going in but I'll give it my best shot.

Jim,
Too bad on St. Judes. But like you said...back to business.