Interior Trim

[Brett Nelson]

Looking for some opinions. I'm getting ready to trim out my new home. I realize that a lot of you prefer to use poplar for interior trim, but cost doesn't allow it. Anyway, that isn't my question. I will need a lot of 1x6 S4S flat stock. Something like 2600 lineal feet. I was going to use 3/4"x5-1/5" Raw MDF, but my lumberyard guy is trying to talk me into just going with #2 common 1x6x16' pine. He claims that he just helped trim out a house with it and they only had a handful of boards that were deemed unsuited for paint grade trim.

Obviously clear lumber would be best, but will the #2 common work well enough for painted base and window/door casing? Or will there just be too many knots?

[Von Bickley]

When my house was trimmed out, we use wood for the crown molding and chair rail. We went with MDF baseboard.

[Jason Roehl]

Your version of quality and the lumberyard guys' may differ greatly. Personally, I think painted #2 pine looks like crap without an insane amount of prep.

MDF has its own challenges as trim. It is fragile until installed, and anywhere it is shaped and bare MDF edges are exposed, it is difficult to paint without some extra effort in priming and sanding.

What's your goal for the painted trim package? Get it done for cheap? Best possible? Or some compromise between the two?

[Brett Nelson]

Well, the house would be considered high end, but I'm running into budget issues now. That isn't to say I want the cheapest possible, but rather that I don't want to spend money on something that would otherwise go unnoticed.

I don't really want to be running along every baseboard with filler trying to smooth out a knot every 6". I generally don't love finger joint trim as I see the joints lift when painted with water based paints. OTOH, I don't see the point in getting perfectly clear pine either.

I really like certain characteristics of MDF and it requires very little prep, but it has issues of course. I think poplar is just out of the question because of price. Obviously, the #2 pine is a great price, but I don't want to be spending 2 weeks getting to know my can of wood filler.

In short, it does still have to look high-end, but I'm not against MDF.

[Ben Franz]

I, for one, don't have any overwhelming issues with MDF trim. It can mushroom if your nailer pressure isn't adjusted properly, it isn't good where water gets on it (baseboards in bathrooms, etc.) and, as Jason points out, cut edges can be a problem.

I've always used pre-primed stock and mouldings when available. Most of the commercially available trim is primed and it's less expensive than field priming. I think the quality of the finished surface is equal to good poplar for less money. Probably run many thousands of feet of MDF trim - no regrets. That plastic c**p the borg was pushing for a while is another story but that's another topic entirely.

[Jason Roehl]

I'm with Ben on this if you consider it to be a high-end home. Trim is a double-edged sword that way. You can build a huge, fancy house, but if the trim and paint are cheap, they will stick out like sore thumbs. Do a great job on them and don't skimp, and few will notice.

I'd shop around for a pre-primed MDF package in the profile you want. There are primed packages that have a noticeably thicker coat of primer than others, which is great (unless the factory stacked it too soon!).

[Jim Kountz]

Do some looking around, I can buy poplar for less than #2 pine at the borgs. I would never ever trim a house I was going to live in with MDF...........again. I tried that crap with my house and I have been slowly replacing it over the years as I get time. It swells up, then it gaps open, if you're coping it dont expect fine details cause most of them will break off very easily. You have to handle it carefully. Poplar is a dream to work with for trim. It mills nice and is easier to prep. It holds details better and to me provides better end results. Your mileage may vary.

[Paul Greathouse]

The preprimed MDF package that Jason and Ben have mentioned will probably be your cheapest choice. There is one other alternative that would look good but you would have to check the price difference verses the package. You could do built-up molding by running the 3/4" MDF and go with a base cap on top of it, then you wouldn't have to route the MDF.

I've also used base cap as part of built-up door and window casing. When doing built-up the possibilities are almost endless and if done right it looks very high end.

[Dan Hahr]

2600 feet? How big is this house?

[Tom Godley]

I second a look at the better mdf.

Many years ago I was forced to remove all the base moldings and door trim for a large remodel in my house. What I was left with was a 5" inch band of rough plaster around the entire house that had to be covered - not to mention all the door trim areas that had to be redone. The only rational economical solution was to cover all with rough and damaged areas with wide enough moldings. I had spent a lot of time and money on this project and I wanted it to look better than just good. After much looking and comparing we ended up - with some trepidation - going with a pre primed mdf.

This original project was 15 years ago and I have been very happy with the results. I was able to get a large profile mdf moulding to cover all the areas - this at a cost less than what standard pine moulding would have been. Having the ability to install 16' pre-primed pieces is a real treat. The mdf painted up beautifully and has remained stable ever since.

We did learn to minimize the nailing and to use dots of glue to attach the mdf -- as well as to go along and hit all the cuts and nail holes with primer.

I would recommend it and have used it many times since. Not sure why others have a problem with it? We have it in the bathrooms with no problems.

Look around it is not all the same - the better stuff is thicker with more detail and has a better finish on it.

[Brian Peters]

I still think go with the poplar. Most lumberyards that mill pine moulding leave a horrible cut on it with tons of chatter that will show in the light later on if unsanded well. I can get poplar primed moulding here in quantity for only a little bit more. The overall cost is a bit more but its worth it IMO. MDF baseboard is good but doesn't take abuse well. Plus it's a pain to nail and even more a paint to cope as it doesn't hold its details. If it's s4s and a cap is put on it with no exposed edges I think it would work fine for you though.

[Don Bullock]

Brett, I'm in s similar situation. MDF seems to be the best choice for me as well. Yes, I realize that I'm a woodworker and MDF isn't wood, but I'd much rather save some money on the painted molding in the house that can be used for some of the oak trim that I'm also installing in parts of the house. In my case I'm buying MDF molding that has been primed from our local lumber company through a contractor who is getting it with his discount.

[Matthew Voss]

My local building supplier sells pre-primed 1x finger jointed pine in up to 16' lengths.

Inexpensive, smooth, paints very nicely.

[Matthew Voss]

I generally don't love finger joint trim as I see the joints lift when painted with water based paints.

I should add that while quality can certainly vary with FJ, major manufacturers like Windsor One machine finger joints precisely and are factory primed with no telegraphing.

[Allen Tomaszek]

Where are you located and what is your budget? MDF would work but as others have pointed out if you look around you can find a variety of woods at a low price.

[frank shic]

brett, i would never pick PINE over MDF if it's going to be painted. MDF is much more stable than solid wood. just make sure you get the proportions right. check out:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1402736282/ref=ord_cart_shr?%5Fencoding=UTF8&m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&v=glance

[Prashun Patel]

MDF all the way if you're painting. It machines easy and conforms to wall irregularities way better than any solid wood. Prime with Zinsser BIN and you won't have trouble with end grain.

I have MDF in my house and it holds up extremely well - especially on crowns.

The only place I'd use wood is on skinny moldings like shadowboxes, and on shoe moldings, because they get kicked way too much to be done in anything but wood.

I'm no pro, but I've done enough trim work in my own house to believe that a higher end end-product will be achieved through the clever use of built-up stock moldings. I'd spend my time on installation - not on milling.

[Matthew Voss]

I'll be the contrarian and suggest you don't use mdf as a first choice, especially having stated you aren't necessarily looking for the cheapest possible.

You won't find mdf trim with the kind of sharp and clearly defined profiles that are available in better quality fj pine.


MDF all the way if you're painting. It machines easy and conforms to wall irregularities way better than any solid wood.

Also, I'm not sure I would want the trim conforming to a crooked wall. Especially with baseboard, this only accentuates the bow/bend. I think straight trim will make a crooked wall look straighter and improve the look of the out of square corners.

Lastly, wood trim is much easier to cope without damaging the profile as the joints go together.

[Brett Nelson]

Thanks for the suggestions guys.

Dan Hahr -- This home I'm building for myself. It is about 4,200sf finished.

Frank Shic -- I actually have that book in my lap as I type this. It is probably the most incredible book ever written for traditional homes like mine.

Allen Tomaszek -- I'm in Northern Utah. We don't have a lot of the problems with humidity causing things to go crazy here. Most days are 10% humidity. My budget is right around $5,500 for materials, but that doesn't include things like mantles, stair parts, or cabinetry of course.


Overall, I'm not against MDF as far as surface finish goes, but I've been told that if I were to case a window in MDF and a door next to it in poplar, that there would be a noticeable difference. That doesn't make much sense to me since the casings are just S4S flat stock for the pillasters. The crossheads would all be the same configuration, as would the stools.

[Brian Peters]

Problem is the edges will paint terribly unless you buy a premium grade mdf like Rangerboard. They would look noticeably different. MDF paints well looks great in moderation but doesn't take the abuse like poplar does.

[Brett Nelson]

The edges of the casings would be rounded though, so I don't think the MDF would have a problem then. I realize that poplar is more durable. I had intended to use poplar for door casings, but MDF for window casings since they don't take much abuse.

[Chris Padilla]

I recently trimmed out my living room remodel. I went with finger-jointed pine from Lowes. It took some time at Lowes but I managed to cull out good, straight quality stock. From what I could tell, it all came from South America. Most of it was quite clear and the joints do not show (it was also pre-primed).

Anyway, the price was right and it all turned out well.

I've put MDF in other rooms in my house and you know what, it just isn't durable. It is so dense that a little bump/bang on any detail will result in damage. I won't ever use it again.

[Tom Godley]

I must be lucky with MDF because I think is is great stuff - not perfect but better than most pine molding currently on the market. I have had no durability problems -- what durability problems have people had?? I find it more dent resistant than any pine molding!

The only complaint that I have is that some of the base moulding are a little thin -- but you only notice this if you mix molding types. Once it is all painted I think it looks great. I have never installed MDF purchased from the big box stores - maybe they sell a lesser quality?? I wonder if some are thinking foam molding are MDF??

The main reason I like MDF is you can get it in the large sizes that are an absolute fortune in wood -- if they are even available without special ordering a run. Also with MDF I never cope -- I measure the inside and out side corners with an angle gauge and cut the split angle -- use a little glue behind the joint and some Phenoseal in the joint.

I guess it all come down to what matters and where we want to spend our money. I would rather go with MDF and spend more on the hardware and the flooring.

[Prashun Patel]

You won't find mdf trim with the kind of sharp and clearly defined profiles that are available in better quality fj pine.

Also, I'm not sure I would want the trim conforming to a crooked wall. Especially with baseboard, this only accentuates the bow/bend. I think straight trim will make a crooked wall look straighter and improve the look of the out of square corners.

Lastly, wood trim is much easier to cope without damaging the profile as the joints go together.

Matthew, I defer to your experience which is probably more extensive than mine. But my experience has been that clearly defined profiles can be achieved with ease by using built up profiles.
I'm also not talking about a wall that's tremendously convex or concave. However, with crown, even a slight wave in the wall will have large implications on crowns ability to be gapless. With mdf, it's less of an issue than wood.
I also find mdf to cope much easier than pine. It requires very little force, and is extremely easy to file to perfection. My mdf copes are way more 'perfect looking' than my wood ones.

One downside of MDF is it's ability to hold a nail. I find this easily overcome by doubling up on the nails - using 15ga fin nails of course, or using narrow crown staples.

[Matthew Voss]

I also find mdf to cope much easier than pine. It requires very little force, and is extremely easy to file to perfection. My mdf copes are way more 'perfect looking' than my wood ones.


Yes, the cope CUTS are easy, but the profile is more prone to damage as the joints are pushed together, especially if the peices are sprung.

I have no issues with mdf and think it can look very good, it just wouldn't be my first choice and the OP said he wasn't necessarily looking for the cheapest option.

Also, mdf is typically machined with carbide knives (as opposed to steel with wood trim) and just can't produce the same sharp profiles. Of course, if the OP is just using flat stock, this might not be an important consideration.

Again, the OP was asking about running painted base, and that the house would be considered high-end and I find that the thicker, more rigid fj base will not highlight every subtle wave in a wall. I just think this is especially important with base. When I have run mdf base, I shim them straight, away from the wall if necessary.

[Brett Nelson]

I agree in that MDF has treated me well in the past also. This house in particular, any MDF will likely just be S4S flats. I decided to do all the base with S4S and use a base cap and shoe. This makes it really easy to use poplar in the wet locations without it looking different. I can also avoid the problems of MDF moldings; shallow profiles, rounded edges, etc.

[Tom Hargrove]

When we remodeled our home, I used poplar moldings, in part because poplar was competitively priced for what I was needed. I fabricated wainscoating out of MDF for the dining room, which sits on top of the poplar moldings and next to the poplar casing. I worked hard to properly prime and paint, both materials, and you cannot tell the difference between them. It has been four years, and none of the MDF has separated, dented or broken. We have significant temperature and humidity swings in Chicago.

I have also seen several high end homes ($1M before the housing slump) in our area that used MDF trim. They had good paint jobs, and looked great. I would have no qualms about trimming a home in MDF.

[Brett Nelson]

I guess I should probably have clarified a bit. The moldings will be built as follows:

Crown:
3" crown
4" facia
4" soffit
2" bed mould

Door/Window Pillasters:
1x4 S4S flat stock

Door Window Headers:
3/8"x2.5" bullnosed cap
2" crown
5.5" freize
3/8"x1.25" stop mould

Window Stools:
1"x## Bullnosed silll
1/2" cove
3.5" ogee base mould as apron

Base:
Cove/Ogee base cap
1x6 S4S flat stock
1/2x3/4 base shoe

There is also a coffered ceiling, fireplace mantel, and some wainscoat/wallframing that needs to be done. The house is a very classical 2-story colonial. 12" round columns, polished marble floors, etc. I don't want the trim to be an eyesore, but I was hoping that MDF crown and flat stock would be able to go unnoticed as the savings would pretty much pay for the entire wrought iron railing on an open staircase. I budgeted about $5,500 for the trim materials and the bids I'm getting from local mills are right in that range, but I was hoping that strategic use of MDF would allow me to get that down to around $4,000. I did get a bid from my lumberyard for MDF/FJ pine that was in the $4500 range, but I've heard that people have problems with painted FJ trim. ?!?!

[Stephen Edwards]

I'm blessed to live near a sawmill that sells "seconds" or culls at a great price. For the mill to send it on to the kiln that they sell to all the boards have to be a full 1" thick from one end to the other.

Of course, there's always a board or two on each log that doesn't meet that requirement. They bundle these seconds into bundles of 800-1100 BF per bundle. Boards range in length from 8'-16". Species are poplar, walnut, cherry, several kinds of oak, ash, and a few others. At least 2/3 of each bundle will be a minimum of 3/4 thick. Many of the boards will be 7/8" on one end and a full one inch on the other end. Widths vary from 4" to 12".......7"-8" is the average.

I know the guy in charge of the mill and ask him when they'll be sawing a particular species that I want. He tells me and I show up that week to get my bundle or bundles. Some bundles will be mostly poplar. Nice clear boards, too!

I sticker them in the barn and let them dry. I've made the mouldings in my house from cherry that came from these bundles. In fact, I'm still working on it one room at a time. I'm also putting new board and batten siding on the 100 year old barn here, using this sawmill lumber. I'm about 1/3 done with the barn project.

The BEST part about it is that the bundles cost $75 each! I give a friend another $25 to go with me to the mill with his long heavy duty trailer. They load the lumber with a big forklift at the mill. So, I only have to handle it once to get it in the barn and sticker it.

Granted, it's not something useful if you're in a hurry. But, if you live in the boonies like I do and aren't in a hurry, this lumber is a great resource for interior trim and other projects, too. The poplar is perfect for trim in about a year.

At appx. 10 cents per board foot, I love it!

[Brian Peters]

Sounds like a fun project. Problem with FJ pine and this varies vastly amongst suppliers is the cut quality is usually bad. Around here they all have chatter to some degree. I have a feeling its because they push their moulding too fast through the molder, too high a feedrate. Your strategy of MDF crown and flat stock will work well we all do it. I said MDF is good but in moderation. If the customer allows and its paint grade there's no reason why you can't do a two part base and do the flat s4s out of mdf with a poplar cap. Or a built up crown with the flat s4s being MDF as well. It's not cheating and it can save you a lot of money. Some home owners are purists and if they will pay for it sure poplar all the way but if not MDF is a great alternative. Not to mention MDF is pretty stable joints hold up a lot better. I just don't like doing door casings or basemoulding near doorways in MDF as its prone to fast wear.

[Matthew Voss]

...but I've heard that people have problems with painted FJ trim. ?!?!

Does the fjp come pre-primed from your lumberyard?

If the joints telegraph its usually because woods with different qualitites (like age or species) are joined, not because of the paint used. The adjacent pieces are expanding and contracting at different rates.

I personally like using fjp trim. Go and have a look at the quality of the trim at your lumberyard and decide for yourself:)

[Matthew Minnig]

Does anyone know a good source of general knowledge about trimming out a house? I am generally dissatisfied with the workmanship of the previous owner both in regards to trim fitting and finishing. Even more so after reading the posts in this thread. Basically make believe your son was about to trim out his home and knew nothing about the process, what would you show him or tell him to read?

Oh yeah, and sorry to hijack but I am certain we would all love to see some photos of the house coming along!

[Prashun Patel]

I like the Creative Homeowner books:
Decorating with Architectural Details and
Decorating with Architectural Trimwork

Lots of good ideas and techniques in there.

I also like Gary Katz's website.

[Brett Nelson]

No problem, I'll post some pics of the house if anyone is interested in seeing them. I'm doing all the finish carpentry including cabinets. I also built most of the house myself. The wife is getting pretty good with a framing nailer. :D

As far as trim books go... the ones mentioned from creative homeowner are ok and I have them. I think the book already mentioned in this thread is an absolute must read. "Get Your House Right" by Cusato. Other than that, pay the subscription to fine homebuilding and fine woodworking websites and start reading through articles.

[Rob Diz]

with 2600 feet of trim, you might want to consider getting a used Woodmaster with a molding head and a few molding knives and making your own trim. You could probably sell that machine for about what you have in it at the end of your work if you don't want it anymore, and be "revenue neutral". You could also buy one new and make your own trim, and if you don't like it I think they have a 30 day return policy. Get their materials - they advertise that folks make money on the trim. I wouldn't be in it for the money, but for a quality product at a good price. I got a used one recently and have been impressed with the simplicity and the build quality. Used would be the way to go IMHO, if you can find one at the right price.

Just another way to get what you want (a high quality product) at a reasonable cost, with the possibility of having a nice ww tool when you are done.

I'm just sayin . . .

[Brett Nelson]

How long would it take to run 2500 lineal feet of crown and base cap with the Woodmaster 712?

Also, do I have to buy a shaper for every different moulding profile?

[Doug Miller 303]

I still think go with the poplar. Most lumberyards that mill pine moulding leave a horrible cut on it with tons of chatter that will show in the light later on if unsanded well. I can get poplar primed moulding here in quantity for only a little bit more. The overall cost is a bit more but its worth it IMO. MDF baseboard is good but doesn't take abuse well. Plus it's a pain to nail and even more a paint to cope as it doesn't hold its details. If it's s4s and a cap is put on it with no exposed edges I think it would work fine for you though.


I will vehemently disagree with Brian here. I enjoy coping the MDF moldings. The saw blade cuts the material like butter, and doesn't follow the grain like softwoods. In order to avoid the problems with losing the details, cope it "loose", and then do the final trim with a razor knife.

I also like to use a variety of rasps to get the shape just perfect. The microplanes work wonders here for taking lots of material off quickly when double coping the crown mouldings.

I put some built up dentil crown in a million dollar house about five years ago, and the joints are still invisible.

Definitely go for it, nobody will be able to tell the difference when yer done.

Doug

[Brett Nelson]

Well, I considered just buying the Woodmaster 712 with a few knives, but I think the amount of time it will take to find one is going to be a problem. I've not been able to find one in my area for sale and I would need it by next week. Probably woulda been a great option if I had considered it about 3 weeks ago when I had some down time while the drywallers were doing their thing. I ran the numbers and I would be looking at a total cost savings of about $2,000 as the lumberyard will sell me rough poplar at $1.50bf. That savings would be enough to make it worth it, but I simply can't find a machine for sale in my area, and none of those that I have found are willing to ship to me.

[Chris Padilla]

I will vehemently disagree with Brian here. I enjoy coping the MDF moldings. The saw blade cuts the material like butter, and doesn't follow the grain like softwoods. In order to avoid the problems with losing the details, cope it "loose", and then do the final trim with a razor knife.

I also like to use a variety of rasps to get the shape just perfect. The microplanes work wonders here for taking lots of material off quickly when double coping the crown mouldings.

I put some built up dentil crown in a million dollar house about five years ago, and the joints are still invisible.

Definitely go for it, nobody will be able to tell the difference when yer done.

Doug

Actually, I think MDF is fine for crown but I won't ever use it again for base, casings, chair, etc...basically anywhere it could be kicked or dinged. It just doesn't hold up well to abuse...it is too dense.

[Chris Padilla]

Well, I considered just buying the Woodmaster 712 with a few knives, but I think the amount of time it will take to find one is going to be a problem. I've not been able to find one in my area for sale and I would need it by next week. Probably woulda been a great option if I had considered it about 3 weeks ago when I had some down time while the drywallers were doing their thing. I ran the numbers and I would be looking at a total cost savings of about $2,000 as the lumberyard will sell me rough poplar at $1.50bf. That savings would be enough to make it worth it, but I simply can't find a machine for sale in my area, and none of those that I have found are willing to ship to me.

Brett,

Where is your area? Maybe Creekers can help you out. Have you ever used Snarfer? It makes scouring craigslist and eBay very easy (be sure to get the craigslist plugin...just google everything and you'll be up and running in 10 minutes).

[Brett Nelson]

I'm in Northern Utah.

[Brett Nelson]

Still no luck on finding a woodmaster anywhere close to my area. I've gotten in touch with the salesman. Maybe I'll jsut ahve to buy one new.

[Prashun Patel]

Still no luck on finding a woodmaster anywhere close to my area. I've gotten in touch with the salesman. Maybe I'll jsut ahve to buy one new.

Brett, I don't mean to poo-poo your idea, but in your calculations, factor in your time. There are so many sources of molding, it just doesn't make sense (to me) for you to spend yr effort this way.

I'm as frugal (or more) than the next guy, but my instinct is yr going down a road that's not worth it.

Good luck, though, whatever you choose; I'm sure the end product will be fantastic!

[Rob Russell]

Brett,

Whatever you do - stay away from #2 pine for trim unless you're just clear sealing it and you want the rustic look of the knots.

My Dad has a little summer cottage. He did a bar and used #2 pine. Even though we sealed the knots, the pitch has bled through the paint over time.

[Brett Nelson]

Brett, I don't mean to poo-poo your idea, but in your calculations, factor in your time. There are so many sources of molding, it just doesn't make sense (to me) for you to spend yr effort this way.

I'm as frugal (or more) than the next guy, but my instinct is yr going down a road that's not worth it.

Good luck, though, whatever you choose; I'm sure the end product will be fantastic!

Yeah, it doesn't look like it is gonna work out anyway. The main reason I was considering it was because I've been meaning to get a planer. This would've given me an opportunity to get the planer at essentially break even. I think I'll just outsource the trim this time and keep trying to find a used woodmaster.

[Brett Nelson]

Brett,

Whatever you do - stay away from #2 pine for trim unless you're just clear sealing it and you want the rustic look of the knots.

My Dad has a little summer cottage. He did a bar and used #2 pine. Even though we sealed the knots, the pitch has bled through the paint over time.

Yeah, I stopped by Lowe's after I made my initial post and took a look at their 1X pine. Prep woulda taken forever to get that ready for paint.

[Rob Russell]

Yeah, I stopped by Lowe's after I made my initial post and took a look at their 1X pine. Prep woulda taken forever to get that ready for paint.

The prep time isn't the problem. We sealed the knots with shellac and a Kilz sealer. The pitch still bled through.

[Brett Nelson]

Well, we had our designer over to discuss paint schemes, countertops, and flooring choices. Next thing I know, there is graffiti all over the walls with her ideas about what I should do for trim.

We were butting heads a bit when discussing crown moulding. It seems that a 2 or 3-piece crown has become the standard for custom homes. You know what I'm talking about I'm sure. Colonial base with a 1" reveal on the wall and ceiling over which a 4.5" crown in applied. I'm not saying that it is wrong to do it that way, it just isn't the look I am going for. That style of "built-up" molding is something that modern houses have made standard. I was looking for more of a Londonesque early colonial "period look". IOW, 3.5" crown backed by a 4.5" facia with a 1" reveal and a back-edge cove creating a "drip-edge". This is tied to the wall by a 5" soffit, under which is applied a 2.5" bedmold.

I draw it out for her and I get a blank stare. Then she says, "I don't undertand why you would want to do your crown like that."
I was getting a bit frustrated at this point and replied, "Because that is the proper way to install a full entablature." Unfortunately, I was getting a little short on patience and my response was a bit more rebuking than it should have been. It just disappoints me that these great period styles have been lost in modern architectural/interior design schools.

Anyway, back on point, after she finished I figured I would need about twice as much trim material as previously estimated. This made MDF trim an absolute necessity. I began installing the MDF crown last night. I was concerned that i wasn't going to be able to cope the insde corners. I pulled out my Collins foot and my Bosch 1587 jig saw and went after it. I opted for the T244D bosch blades. They went through the MDF trim like butter with a beautiful edge. The copes look great. I do have to be a little more gentle with the saw, but I was pleasantly surprised that I didn't have to break out the hand coping saw or revert to mitered corners.

[Stephen Edwards]

I draw it out for her and I get a blank stare. Then she says, "I don't undertand why you would want to do your crown like that."


The thing about that statement from the designer that would annoy me would be that it's YOUR house. The fact that you know how you want it and that you explained it to her should be sufficient. She doesn't need to understand WHY you want it that way! That would've chapped me, too!

[Chris Padilla]

I think MDF for crown is wonderful...nothing will touch it except spiders, a few moths, and maybe a duster now and then. Do you have any pics, Brian? I'd like to see your rendering...sounds interesting and rather complicated. :)

[Brett Nelson]

The crown is similar in construction to this setup by WindsorOne.

http://www.windsorone.com/moldings/classic/details.asp

Profiles are different though.

[Brett Nelson]

Well, when you pay someone $75/hr to tell you what colors to paint your house, and what style carpet to put in, they tend to think that you don't know anything. But my wife was lost when it came time to pull everything together.

[Jay Goddard]

I recently purchased a very large order of poplar trim direct from a mill in Ohio: www.bairdbros.com (http://www.bairdbros.com)

Most of what I ordered was pre-primed finger jointed stock. I was amazed at the quality of the trim (very straight and clear), especially compared to the junk that is sold at HD/Lowes. Compare the prices on Baird Brothers web site vs your local stores. I saved a lot of money and got much better quality trim, even after paying a few hundred dollars to freight the 16' pallet to South Carolina.

I have no connection to Baird Bros. except for being a happy customer.

[Chris Padilla]

The crown is similar in construction to this setup by WindsorOne.

http://www.windsorone.com/moldings/classic/details.asp

Profiles are different though.

Wow, quite fancy-schmancy indeed! I guess I'm not used to such "grand" trim in the houses I'm used to. One piece of base or crown and that was all she wrote. Looks like lottsa work but it will be spectacular!

[Brett Nelson]

Wow, quite fancy-schmancy indeed! I guess I'm not used to such "grand" trim in the houses I'm used to. One piece of base or crown and that was all she wrote. Looks like lottsa work but it will be spectacular!

Wasn't too much work once I got the nailer strips up on the ceiling and walls. I biscuited blocks to the ceiling nailer about every 3 ft. and attached the facia to that. Soffit then went up easy. Of course after that the crown and bedmold were a snap.

[Chris Padilla]

Wasn't too much work once I got the nailer strips up on the ceiling and walls. I biscuited blocks to the ceiling nailer about every 3 ft. and attached the facia to that. Soffit then went up easy. Of course after that the crown and bedmold were a snap.

Sounds like a piece of cake! ;)

[Prashun Patel]

Built up cornice moldings are fantastic (as is yours), but I wouldn't beat yrself up thinking you have to do it in EVERY room.

Molding should be room-appropriate. A grand, tall molding can overwhelm a small room.

[Brett Nelson]

Built up cornice moldings are fantastic (as is yours), but I wouldn't beat yrself up thinking you have to do it in EVERY room.

Molding should be room-appropriate. A grand, tall molding can overwhelm a small room.

It isn't going to be in every room. That is just the foyer/greatroom/diningroom area. It is essentially a 900sf space with taller ceilings. Pretty much all the other rooms have crown, but most have either just a 4" crown, or a 4" crown and picture rail.

[Prashun Patel]

It isn't going to be in every room. That is just the foyer/greatroom/diningroom area. It is essentially a 900sf space with taller ceilings. Pretty much all the other rooms have crown, but most have either just a 4" crown, or a 4" crown and picture rail.

Make sure u post pix.

Gotta love picture rail. People don't use it enough, IMHO.

Picture or caprails hung 6-9" below the ceiling are a neat trick to give height to a ceiling and make it easier to paint.

[Brett Nelson]

Make sure u post pix.

Gotta love picture rail. People don't use it enough, IMHO.

Picture or caprails hung 6-9" below the ceiling are a neat trick to give height to a ceiling and make it easier to paint.

Yeah, picture rails have pretty much been forgotten in most of the custom homes these days. People are opting for really elaborate 10" crown profiles when really I think that many times a simple 4" crown and a picture rail have a much more elegant and refined look.

I actually saw a really nice living room in which the designer had used the picture rail in place of a curtain rod. She fastened the tops of the drapes to the picture rail using pins that had been upholstered with a fabric matching those of the drapes.

I'll take pictures once I've made a bit more progress, so that there is actually something to look at.

[Chris Padilla]

Yeah, Brett, no pics...it is all just hot air!! ;)

:D

[Brett Nelson]

Yeah, Brett, no pics...it is all just hot air!! ;)

:D

You're not even gonna let me pretty it up a little with some wood filler and caulk first? Maybe get a coat of paint on it too? :D

[Chris Padilla]

cut, cope, cuss, caulk, paint...beer time

:D