Help me with "essential" hand planes

[Dan Karachio]

Okay, ready to take the plunge, but I need help. I'm not super mechanical, but I have learned to sharpen chisels and planes. I am going to build a bench and need planes to flatten the top. I actually have a cheap bench to practice on and I can't wait to rip into that. After all that, I plan to just build furniture as well as cabinet projects for the house. I own a cheapo block plane and a #4 knock off, but that's it, and these are not good planes. So, say I have a top limit of $700 to spend. What would you recommend I get?

Lie Nielsen has a set they seem to recommend with their Adjustable Mouth Block Plane, 4 1/2 and Low Angle Jack Plane. Are these the right planes to start with and build on? If not, what? I have read the Fine Woodworking article on essential planes, but it has something like 12 "essential" planes. Power tool guys often list the four essential tools (table saw, jointer, planer, bandsaw...), can hand tool guys do the same with planes? :-)

P.S. Having a wooden plane, like Knights toolworks would be fun too.

[Casey Gooding]

The joinery Plane set from Lie-Nielsen would certainly be nice and a good start. I would add a jointer plane and a shoulder plane when you can.
My personal preference would include a Low angle block plane, #4 smoother, #5 jack and a #7 or #8 jointer and a shoulder plane.
If you don't mind putting some elbow grease in them, there are plenty of good old Stanley planes available. On your budget, I would buy a Stanley #4, #5 and #7 and Lie-Nielsen block and shoulder plane.
It's a slippery slope. Be careful :)

[Ben Davis]

Don't forget that with little more than a band saw, you can build your own Krenov-style plane. It's certainly an option.

[John Dykes]

Bench planes have a few different uses - stock removal, flattening, smoothing, and so on. For a task such as flattening a bench, a long plane would be of great benefit - a #7 is commonly used for this task. The beefy #8 would work as well.

Chris Schwartz has a video called Coarse, Medium, and Fine. He discusses these three various phases of stock preparation and categorizes the range of bench planes into these functions:
Coarse (stock removal) tools being the 5,6
Medium (flattening) tools being the 7,8
Fine (smoothing) tools being 2,3,4 (and 1 I suppose).

So let's start there... In just getting started with hand planes, you'll see immediate results in two things - smoothing and flattening. (Stock prep with a jack or fore plane is - well, Hand Planes 101 (to steal from Mr. Keeton).) So we're looking at just two planes... and most commonly recommended would be a #7 and a #4, or #4 1/2. If you go the LN route, you've spent your budget... on two great tools. But...

If you're just starting to peer over the slope, I'd ask that you consider not blowing your whole budget on your first two good tools. Get a Stanley #4(or 4.5) and a #7. Cut your teeth on them and learn them inside and out. Feel free to post about specific items you're looking at - folks here will help you out. There are also some reputable tool dealers we can point you to. In the end, you'll be out $150 on two planes that will hold their value.

Shoulder plane, block plane, rabbet plane? Eh, you can... But I'd say just start with the two (4, 7). Get a feel for them and learn some technique and get a feel for the wood. When you wish you had a shoulder or rabbet plane, you can get one. Additionally, you might find you'd like to have a new saw or chisel before a new plane...

Again, we're happy to walk you through the purchase of an older plane... or even get it tuned up for you.

Hope that helps...

* Might get further help in person if you post where you are located...

[Danny Thompson]

A versatile option that hits your price point is the Lee Valley Triumvurate--the Veritas Bevel-Up Planes:

Veritas Bevel-Up Smoother Plane ($219)
Veritas Low-angle Jack Plane ($219)
Veritas Bevel-Up Jointer Plane ($279)

The beauty of owning bevel-up planes is that they can be sharpened with a variety of bevel angles (Low - 25º, standard - 38º, and high/York - 50º) to handle a variety of grains. And since the blades on these 3 planes are interchangeable, you can maintain 3 blades at the 3 different angles and swap them around as needed.

Another nice plane to add to this arsenal is a Lie-Nielsen No 102 Low-angle Block Plane. Fits in the hand nicely and is great for a lot of small tasks. That adds another $100 to the outlay.

[Chris Friesen]

I am going to build a bench and need planes to flatten the top. I actually have a cheap bench to practice on and I can't wait to rip into that. After all that, I plan to just build furniture as well as cabinet projects for the house. I own a cheapo block plane and a #4 knock off, but that's it, and these are not good planes. So, say I have a top limit of $700 to spend. What would you recommend I get?

Think about exactly what you want to use them for, then read http://popularwoodworking.com/article/understanding_bench_planes (http://blog.woodworking-magazine.com/blog/ct.ashx?id=d19e619d-0a91-452a-a4e6-46474b573722&url=http%3a%2f%2fpopularwoodworking.com%2farticle% 2funderstanding_bench_planes)

Assuming you have a powered jointer/planer, then you don't immediately need anything for rough stock removal (this would normally be the scrub, jack, and fore planes). That leaves final stock prep, smoothing, joinery, and details.

A jointer plane is good for getting your stock absolutely straight, and for straightening out long pieces (like your bench components). People I respect say that a bevel-down jointer is easier to use, that said I own a bevel-up jointer. You can also use a jack or fore plane for this, but it won't be quite as convenient--you'll want to check more frequently with a straightedge to check your progress. A bevel-up jack plane can be used on its side with a shooting board, allowing you to shave a few thousandths off the length of a board, or get a miter absolutely dead-on.

The 4, 4 1/2, or a bevel up smoother would be the most common smoothing planes. At least one of the bevel-up planes (the "low-angle smoother" from Lee Valley) can also be used on the shooting board. The "bevel-up smoother" shares blades with the remaining two bevel-up planes but can't be used on a shooting board.

Joinery planes are things like plow, rabbet, shoulder, and router planes. Most people would hold off on these.

Lastly, for details and all-around small-scale work there is the block plane.

For starting out, I'd be tempted by a bevel-up jack (for the flexibility of using it with a shooting board), a bevel-up smooth plane, and a low-angle block plane. Later on you could look at a bevel-down jointer, and maybe a shoulder plane, and then go from there.

[Jim Koepke]

Dan,
For starters on planes I would suggest a #3, 4 or 4-1/2 as a smoothing plane. This would depend on your hand size. The #3 is small, 4 medium and 4-1/2 is the large.

A #5 or 5-1/2 for a midsize plane. These are about the same for hand size and if you buy used, the #5 is much more common.

Then a #7 or #8 for the jointer.

For flattening a bench top, it might be easier to use a scraper plane. That is a different story. If you read the article that Chris linked to, this is explained in the write up of the #6.

Since you mention being able to sharpen, it is my suggestion you look for used planes (Stanley's are good as are others) and save some money for the other planes you will want for your other projects. Check out Johnny Kleso's site at:

https://home.comcast.net/~rarebear/planes101/typing/typing.htm

for information about changes made to Stanley planes over the years. My suggestion for best results would be to select models from type 9 to 13. Other types will work fine also, but these have most or all the refinements without the cost cutting that took place in later years.

If you are determined to buy new, that is also a good choice. For me, the hunt for old tools is a lot of the enjoyment. Getting them into shape and using them is a wonderful reward. Besides, every dollar saved is another dollar in my pocket to enable me to buy another. Surely you have heard of the slope haven't you?

After the basic planes, a block plane is a good choice. The 60-1/2 or the 65 are both good low angle block planes. There are a lot of tasks a block plane can do that are at least difficult if not next to impossible to handle with a bench plane. The 60-1/2 is smaller, the 65 is almost too big for small hands.

After using these a while, you will know what tasks you do that requires a particular specialty plane whether it is a rabbet, side rabbet, shoulder or some other purpose oriented plane.

As someone else mentioned, you may want to put your location in your profile. Folks here are happy to help and you may live close to another member who would invite you over or to make a visit with a few planes for you to try out.

Another site to visit to learn more about Stanley planes:

http://www.supertool.com/StanleyBG/stan0a.html

Have fun, for if you are not having fun, you are likely doing the wrong thing.

jim

[James G. Jones]

Dan,

+1 to what Jim posted. If you know how to sharpen, the older Stanley models are not that hard to fettle into excellent performers. If you go this route, your money will go much further. Then you will have more left over for other necessities. You mentioned building a bench. What you save on planes, you are free to spend on the wood, vises, holdfasts and other associated equipment which will make your work easier and more efficient in the long run. As for which planes to get, I like the #3 as a smoother, the 5 1/2 or 6 as fore planes, and the 7 or 8 for jointing. For a block my 60 1/2 adjustable mouth is never far out of reach. That's a pretty basic set that you can add to as your projects dictate.

Whether you buy new or used, as has been mentioned, seek out another creeker in your area. You may find that what works for you is entirely different from what works for me or anyone else for that matter.

Good luck,
James

[John Keeton]

Dan, I have the one qualification on this issue none of the other posters has - I am a beginner and know very little about hand planes!! So, with that, let me tell you what I have found useful.

I have my Dad's "Defiance" #4 clone, which is apparently worth nothing to anyone except me. It has been tuned, sharpened, and cuts with the best of them.

Then, I have the LN low angle adjustable mouth block, the LV BU Jack, with two blades (25 and 50*), and the LV medium shoulder plane. These seem to do all I need to do - for the moment. So, I would suggest that you spend the $700 like this -

Veritas® Low-Angle Jack Plane $219
Extra blade 50* 40
Extra blade at 25* or 38* for scrub 40
Veritas medium shoulder plane 179
Veritas DX60 premium block plane 179 (Could go with the LN, but this is a really, really nice plane!)

Total $657

Use the extra blade for the BU Jack with a camber to use as a scrub plane to flatten your bench top with.

Use the balance to buy a good quality used #4 somewhere, if you need it. But honestly, the Jack, with the three blades is a great plane, and will do most of what you will want to do.

From the above it seems I am shunning LN, and that is not the case. I really like my LN block plane, but for the money the LV is hard to beat.

[Phillip Pattee]

Dan,
Because you mentioned that wooden planes might be a fun option, you might consider this. First, think of a hand plane as essentially a jig to hold a sharp blade so that you can use it consistenly to produce a smooth surface. The size and shape of the plane helps you accomplish certain tasks more efficiently. For a good battery of planes that you would likely use often for building a bench and making furniture, I recommend a jointer, a jack, a smoother, and a block plane. Any that you add beyond this I place in the non-essential category.
Japan Woodworker has some wooden (rosewood and ebony) planes made by Mujingfang. These planes require an adjusting hammer and some practice to set. They have good blades and favorable reviews, and are quite affordable. Consider these:

18" jointer $159.00
11" jack 37.95
7" smoother 31.75
6 1/2" polishing plane (non-essential but will also work as a scraper) 52.25

Total: $280.95 or $225.70 without the polishing plane.

You can spend another $165.00 and pick up the LN low angle adjustable mouth block plane. Total invested $445.75

All planes need maintenance at some point, you can put this off by buying new, but you ultimately cannot avoid it. If you are not in a hurry, you can put together a nice set of vintage stanley planes, tune them up, and have a very servicable set.

[Brian Kent]

Dan,

Japan Woodworker has some wooden (rosewood and ebony) planes made by Mujingfang. These planes require an adjusting hammer and some practice to set. They have good blades and favorable reviews, and are quite affordable. Consider these:

18" jointer $159.00
11" jack 37.95
7" smoother 31.75
6 1/2" polishing plane (non-essential but will also work as a scraper) 52.25

Total: $280.95 or $225.70 without the polishing plane.

You can spend another $165.00 and pick up the LN low angle adjustable mouth block plane. Total invested $445.75



I wholeheartedly agree with this recommendation. For me though the polishing plane is one of the most helpful planes. I do not have the jointer, but the 11" Jack is excellent, the smoother works well, and the 9" polishing plane is absolutely essential. There are many complex grains that only my 9" polish plane can tackle.

I opted for the small LN #102, but if I only had one block plane a LV or LV adjustable mouth low angle smoother would be my choice too.

[Douglas Brummett]

Okay, ready to take the plunge, but I need help. I'm not super mechanical, but I have learned to sharpen chisels and planes. I am going to build a bench and need planes to flatten the top. I actually have a cheap bench to practice on and I can't wait to rip into that. After all that, I plan to just build furniture as well as cabinet projects for the house. I own a cheapo block plane and a #4 knock off, but that's it, and these are not good planes. So, say I have a top limit of $700 to spend. What would you recommend I get?

Lie Nielsen has a set they seem to recommend with their Adjustable Mouth Block Plane, 4 1/2 and Low Angle Jack Plane. Are these the right planes to start with and build on? If not, what? I have read the Fine Woodworking article on essential planes, but it has something like 12 "essential" planes. Power tool guys often list the four essential tools (table saw, jointer, planer, bandsaw...), can hand tool guys do the same with planes? :-)

P.S. Having a wooden plane, like Knights toolworks would be fun too.

Okay, top to bottom here.

Learning to sharpen is a gateway skill. I am still learning more and more myself after about 6 months. Another skill of equal importance to the hand tool user is the ability to setup a hand plane. New imports, high end, or old iron they ALL require tuning to work correctly. The sooner you can acquire this skill the easier the rest of your woodworking life will be ;) Fortunately there are tons of books, articles, videos, and even online tutorials to guide new users through the process.

Next, $700 is a great budget :D I think my whole collection cost right around that mark (no3-8, shoulder, block, rabbet, scrapers) If you are willing to dive into the tuning and restoring as part of your learning curve your budget will go far. My specialty planes are LN. I like LN and buying his tools gives my patriotic side a pat on the back. All of my bench planes are old Stanley planes that have required tuning and refurbishing. Most have Hock irons and cap irons.

Personally I wouldn't pick up the kit you mention. Not enough bang for the bucks. It still leaves you in need of a jointer and blows all your cash.

Knight tool wood planes are nice. You could most likely stay closer to the budget and get a jack, smoother, and jointer in one shot. You would still need to supplement with a block plane elsewhere and you would go over budget by $60-100.

My essential planes for a bench:
Yes, I just built a bench and 95% of it was with these three planes
- LA adj mouth block plane (mine is LN)
- jack plane (mine is a no5 Bailey)
- jointer plane (used the pants off my no608)
Notice there is no smoother in this list. They don't call it a jack for nothing. The jack can be set up as a roughing tool or a smoother. Honestly on a bench though there is not much need for a super-smoother.

[Mark Roderick]

Lots of replies.

The three-plane set from Lie-Neilsen would work great. Add a #7 (jointer) soon.

Three three-plane set from Veritas would also work great. Add a block plane immediately.

You'll be more than thrilled with either of those choices, and as far as choosing between them, flip a coin and you can't go wrong.

[JohnMorgan of Lititz]

Dan,

Is your head swimming from all the different ideas yet? :) You've probably noticed some common denominators in all the replies. The important thing is that there really are no wrong methods that have been mentioned.

I figured I'd throw my $0.01 in the mix..."ditto" to what everyone has mentioned. I do want to warn about the hidden irritations that come along with fixing up an old plane. I have a 40 year old stanley #5 that still to this day does not have a flat sole around the mouth. While its difficult to see with your eye, a straight edge quickly shows the concave mouth...i have worked on this plane for months - ended up buying a new LN 5 1/2. Now I look back at all the wasted time i spent.

My point is, be careful buying old planes - sometimes they are just a lot of work. So you must decide if you want to mess around making something work just so you can actually use it - or buy something that requires little more than tuning up the blade.

Nothing wrong w/ buying old tools, some guys are into fixing up a super-cheap bargain and getting a super fine working tool. Only you can decide...

Then again, I'm very much an amatuer as well...

I'm now a power J&P guy - use the LN 4 1/2 for smoothing down after milling - good to go. I do have a LN #7, 5 1/2, 60 1/2, 40 1/2 - not used much now though - and a #73 shoulder plane.

Like others have said - watch out for the slippery slope. You'll soon start collecting them just to use them. :)

[Dave Spaeder]

This is the kind of question that generates a lot of responses, much of it contradictory and all of it right. When it comes down to it, which tools are best for you comes down to matter of preference and the way you work. Often it takes some time using a tool to realize that you should have made a different choice. Sometimes you buy a new tool and it changes the way you look at the tools you have. The dynamic challenge of finding the right tool for the task and the right way to get the tool to do what you want it to do is part of what I love about woodworking. It's also a great justification for the much mentioned slippery slope of tool buying.

That said, I generally feel like I get the most bang for my buck with used bench planes and new specialty planes. I wouldn't trade my Stanley 4s, 5, 5 1/2 and 7 and my who-knows-who-made-it 8 for anything. They all came off ebay and all of them together cost me less than $150. But with many specialized planes, you'll often find that the newer ones are about the same or cheaper than the models they were based on. Try finding the Stanley bevel-up jack for much less than you'd pay for the LV version (and then see if it's as easy to return if it isn't what you'd hoped).

So my "starter kit" would be an old Stanley 4, maybe a 5, and a 7. Then I'd add a low-angle block, a bevel-up jack, and a shoulder plane from Lee Valley. I haven't exactly done the math, but that should come in considerably below $700.

I'd hold whatever's left as ballast for the inevitable slide down the slippery slope.

[Johnny Kleso]

Do you need New Tools or can you live with used tools that work like new???

You can buy several used Stanley planes with new Stanley, LV, LN or Ron Hock blades that work as well as new planes...

Or you can 2-4 new planes...

I think the LV LA Block Plane is a must have as a used Stanley No.65 sells for about the same price with a new blades...

That and sharpening supplies would be my first buy.....

[Michael Gibbons]

Rob Cosman in his "Handplane and Sharpening" video suggest these four:

LA adj mouth block plane

rabbeting block plane

4 1/2 smoother

8 jointer.

He considers these the shop essentials. You could add to these later, but they should do most of what you need. I have these plus a #6 and a scrub plane.

[Joe Close]

I think the simplest way to start is to follow Chris Schwarz's methodology of coarse, medium, fine. Get the DVD if you have not already. I believe John Dykes speaks to this earlier in the post. This methodology is a simplified way to look at all the planes out there, and allows a person to choose just 3 planes and to get to work using those planes. This of course is a starting point.

I started, not too long ago, and was overwhelmed with all the variations in planes, then throw in the various brand names, and a guy can get lost quickly. I already owned a #5 Stanley from a borg. I figured I could grind a radius in the blade and use this for coarse work. So I bought 2 LN planes, #4 bronze for fine, and #7 for medium. I bought LN because I liked what I read about the planes. No regrets, they are very nice tools. I did also buy a LN adj mouth block plane. The little block planes are just plan handy.

Using Chris’s methods narrows the field considerably. Now, just decide on the band. Others can provide more there than I. I've only used what I've listed above, so my experience with other plane makers is non-existent.

I think they next question needs to be, how much time/work do you want to put into tuning a used plane or lower quality plane. That will direct you to which source of planes, used or new.

[James Owen]

Dan,

Here's my recommendation:

#5-1/2
#7 or #8
Low Angle Adjustable Mouth Block Plane

The 5-1/2 can function as a roughing plane (jack plane or short fore/trying plane) and will also work very nicely as a long smoother/panel plane, simply by loosening or tightening the mouth opening. (FWIW, David Charlesworth and, I believe, Rob Cosman both recommend the #5-1/2, if you can buy only one plane; that says quite a bit about its versatility....)

The #7 or #8 will take care of all of your flattening-type planing requirements. I prefer the #8, but either will work very well.

The LA Adj Mouth block plane is one of the most useful planes ever made; once you have one, you find that you use it in every project.

I highly recommend that you spend the money on (at least) one L-N plane; that will show you what "right" looks like, when it comes to plane performance. The rest of your plane purchases could then be tuned-up vintage planes that can give you almost LN performance for a small percentage of the cost.

As follow-on planes, I'd look at a #4 or #4-1/2 (I personally prefer the #4-1/2, but, again, either will work fine) for a dedicated smoother, and a shoulder plane. A router plane is very useful, if you do very much grooving work (dados, sliding dovetails, etc).

After that, I'd suggest getting the planes that your project requires; that will almost certainly eliminate buying panes that will sit around gathering dust.....

Hope this helps you some.

[Archie England]

Welcome to the slippery side of the slope!!!

With that first whispy shaving that left a wood surface smoother than any sandpaper or sander that I owned could make, I was hooked. I've bought way to many to use, but I have learned from fettling each one. Most of my extras, beyond my other extras, have been given away to friends; cause, friends don't let friends sand unnecessarily.

what surprised me most was which planes became the most useful. First and foremost and useful all the time is a #6, followed by a #5. I typically keep three of each plane out for working. One blade is set for taking coarse cuts (rapid removal), another for medium (leveling), and then fine cuts. There's very little that I can't do with these essential two starters. Both will face wood, edge and joint. Yes, a 4 1/2 and a 5 1/2 work well, too. But I'd rather push that mass in a #6 length, since its length approaches my goal of not leaving dips and valleys (same reason why I prefer a 5 1/4 to a #3 at times). Yep, I've got #7s and an 8, but they just don't make the "use them all the time list." The #4, now, that's the pride and joy of my fleet. Nothing smooths normal grain so sweetly as a 4 (or its little brother, the #3). These form the base for my users, which I keep out all the time.

Since I don't own a #1 or #2, I won't comment. I do own woodie shoulder planes, a scrub (great for getting rough cuts from log-cut planks ready), some 78s, and an assortment of others (remember, I've already confessed to having slid way too far down this slope). However, the #6,#5,and #4 are by far the most used FOR ME. Compared to what I've saved on a larger jointer (yeah, I bought a 6" jointer used but it seldom gets used), planer, and drum sander, I feel like I'm way ahead in savings and space--unless, of course, you count the space to store my extras (hehehe).

AS has been said above, there's no wrong path with any of these--except.....

DON'T BUY CHEAP SUBSTITUTES. Don't buy from just anybody; pick out some great sellers from here or over at Woodnet forum. Don't buy your first handplane unless you're willing to pay the cost for learning how to sharpen these tools--or any hand tools for that fact!!!!!!

Though I didn't buy a LN or LV, I've spent enough to KNOW THAT DOING SO WOULD HAVE ACTUALLY BEEN BETTER AND CHEAPER in the long run. Perhaps my education is richer b/c of the path I took; but, the goal is working wood not tools.

Whatever.....just enjoy, another 2 cents worth!

[Dan Karachio]

Sorry guys, was very busy with work! Wow, so much advice. Thanks! I just picked the $700 figure since that was the price of the LN set, but I am more and more interested in used planes with new blades and, well, saving some $$$. Oh, I'm in Bucks county PA outside Philly.

Beside Jon Zimmer, and http://www.toolauctionsunlimited.com/, are there other trusted source out there for old Stanleys? One more question please. Are the Bailey's good planes overall, or do you recommend Bedrocks?

Right now I think I am leaning this way. Definitely an adjustable mouth low angle block plane and the Lie Nielsen is amazing. I'll go new on that one for sure. A 4 1/2 smoother (I have big hands, so this might be right), but am still a little stuck on jack and jointers 5, 6, 7 or 8s..., corrugated bottom or not...

[Jim Koepke]

Right now I think I am leaning this way. Definitely an adjustable mouth low angle block plane and the Lie Nielsen is amazing. I'll go new on that one for sure. A 4 1/2 smoother (I have big hands, so this might be right), but am still a little stuck on jack and jointers 5, 6, 7 or 8s..., corrugated bottom or not...

Some feel the Bedrocks are better plane. My opinion is based on the finished surface. The Baileys produce a very nice surface for me. I have owned only one Bedrock and sold it after it was refurbished. The Bedrocks are usually priced much higher than a Bailey.

The #5 is a very common plane and should be available at a much better price than a 5-1/2, or 6. If you are stout like me, the 5-1/2 or a 6 is not a hard plane to use. Same with the 8. The bigger the plane and the wider the blade, the more it takes to move it across a piece of wood.

The 4-1/2 is likely going to cost a bit more than a 4.

The 4 and 5 are probably the two most common planes available in the Bailey line. The only plane in the whole line up that is in my shop unused is the 5-1/4. It is just an awkward size for my build.

Now, if you are not totally confused, you just haven't been paying attention. (to paraphrase Edward Murrow)

As stated before, the best place to start is to read Patrick Leach's 'Blood and Gore' the type study at rexmill.com and anything else you can find to give you an idea of what to look for when out on the hunt and what to do with it when you get it home.

Good luck and happy rust hunting,

jim

[Eric Brown]

Whatever you get, you will learn it's capabilities. You will try things that most experienced woodworkers would not normally do. (They already learned the easier way).
For instance, you could flatten a bench with a block plane, but it would be hard to to. But you could do it.
You could also use a long bench plane to smooth. Again it would be harder, but you could do it.
Having a variety that covers the small/medium/large range just makes the work easier (and more fun).
You might also consider getting a few specialty planes.
Many of the earlier posts recommend low angle planes. The advantage is the ability to use a different angle on the blade (or a spare) and in effect gain another plane.
One that could handle difficult grain, etc.
Another plane to consider is a #10 Stanley rabbet (or similar) instead of a jack plane. It's basically the same except you can cut into corners with it. They cost more though. One I will warn you against is the Stanley #78 rabbet. They are low cost and plentiful, but the fence only has one rod and flexes. In addition the blade adjustment is fairly coarse. Better would be a Record #778 or similar.

One of the handies planes is a side rabbet (I have a Stanley 79). The new L-V side rabbet looks good.

If I were to suggest one plane, it would be the new L-V premium block. It works and adjusts beautifully and sometimes I'm tempted to try flattening my bench with it just for the fun of it.

Eric

[lowell holmes]

I have them all. My "go to" planes are 607 Bedrock, LN 4 1/2, LV bevel up Jack, LN 60R, LV Apron Plane, and LV medium Shoulder plane.

I wish I could get off the slope. :-) not really

[Adam Leone]

I have been debating the same question myself lately; this thread has been helpful. I am newbie and challenged myself by buying a big stack of rough walnut and cherry planks off of Craigslist before I had a workshop or hand tools assembled in our new house. I've got about 8 22" wide walnut planks 16' long. I don't think my 13" planer is going to work. I am going to need a few planes just to make the pile smaller...

To echo an earlier question; does anyone know of a source that refurbishes and sells older planes? I know I have seen a name on other threads but I can't seem to find the magic terms tonight. I am give up the thrill of the bargain to avoid the frustrations of an internet surprise.

[David Keller NC]

Sorry guys, was very busy with work! Wow, so much advice. Thanks! I just picked the $700 figure since that was the price of the LN set, but I am more and more interested in used planes with new blades and, well, saving some $$$. Oh, I'm in Bucks county PA outside Philly.

Dan - There is not a thing wrong with buying new planes. I can guarantee you that ten years into this you will have tens of thousands of dollars in shop tools and lumber. No doubt $700 at one swipe of the plastic can be a little bit difficult to swallow, but you will spend your time learning to sharpen and use them instead learning how to spot and avoid (or correct) problems with antiques. So whether to do this or not depends. If you're way short of time, this is by far the best bet. If you're retired and have lots of time on your hands, then you've a decision - do you want to put the time in furniture, or old tools (some of us poor schmucks do both, and never do anything else!).


Beside Jon Zimmer, and http://www.toolauctionsunlimited.com/, are there other trusted source out there for old Stanleys? One more question please. Are the Bailey's good planes overall, or do you recommend Bedrocks?

There are a lot of old tool dealers with good reputations. Among those not mentioned, Lee Richmond at www.thebestthings.com (http://www.thebestthings.com) and Patrick Leach at www.supertool.com (http://www.supertool.com). There is nothing wrong with a Bailey, just as there's nothing wrong with a Honda. But there are lots of us that prefer cars that do more than travel from A to B in as cheap a manner possible. If your intention is to work is non-figured, well-behaved wood such as Eastern White Pine, non-figured maple, straight grain mahogany, etc..., I promise you will never know the difference between a bedrock and a Bailey, or a Lie-Nielsen (which is a much improved Bedrock). If you're more interested in working highly figured and difficult woods (for example, if you intend to make things like jewelry boxes and humidors, where the figure of the wood is of prime importance), comparing a well-tuned Bailey and a Lie-Nielsen will be an eye-opener, to say nothing of a British infill like a Norris.


Right now I think I am leaning this way. Definitely an adjustable mouth low angle block plane and the Lie Nielsen is amazing. I'll go new on that one for sure. A 4 1/2 smoother (I have big hands, so this might be right), but am still a little stuck on jack and jointers 5, 6, 7 or 8s..., corrugated bottom or not...

The low-angle block plane is just about a must-have, and in my opinion, the Lie-Nielsen is a far superior plane to the Stanley antiques (I have both). I would suggest, if you're going antique, to buy a #4 Bailey first. The 4-1/2s bring a bit of a premium, and they are more difficult to get right as a smoother for a newbie. The simple reason is that on a smoother, you're intentionally taking a shaving of about 3 thousandths of an inch thick, and adjusting the camber (curve) on the iron by honing is harder as the iron gets wider because the curve gets shallower. It's also a bit more difficult to get the side-to-side adjustment in the plane right.

And as you continue down this path, I can guarantee that you will not stay with just one smoother - swap meets are too hard to resist.

At this point, you do not need a jack or a fore plane. These are primarily "roughing" planes, designed to hog off big honking shavings off of a rough-sawn board. A board just out of a powered planer needs no such treatment, but they do need the work of a jointer plane. A jointer should be chosen to fit the scale of work you intend to do. If it's large bookcases, the #8 is what you want. If it's jewelry boxes, a #8 would be just plane dumb - a battleship in a bathtub. A #6 used as a jointer would be much more appropriate.

[Dean Karavite]

I'm with you David. I guess I have just come over the hill and seen the slippery slope - yet the slope beckons me to slide and slide. I just picked up my first quality plane this weekend. A Lie Nielsen Low Angle Adjustable Mouth Block Plane. Already, in just one day, I have used it successfully on adjusting some scribing as well as on a drawer. It is unbelievable. It is so much fun to use and it practically drives itself. I respect anyone who can buy an old plane and fix it up, but these new planes are something else.

[Tom Stovell]

Rob Cosman in his "Handplane and Sharpening" video suggest these four:

LA adj mouth block plane

rabbeting block plane

4 1/2 smoother

8 jointer.

He considers these the shop essentials. You could add to these later, but they should do most of what you need. I have these plus a #6 and a scrub plane.

Another video (FWW) from Philip Lowe on the essential handplanes. Just another opinion on where to start:

http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/SkillsAndTechniques/SkillsAndTechniquesArticle.aspx?id=29680

[Phillip Pattee]

Adam,
For reliable vintage Stanley planes, try woodnet forums. Do a search for posts by leonard bailey (the poster's screen name). He has planes for sale regularly. Some other places to look are Brass City Records http://www.brasscityrecords.com/toolworks/new%20tools.html#PLANES
and Bob Kaune's http://www.antique-used-tools.com/stanpl.htm

And you thought you could never have enough clamps--just wait...:rolleyes:

[David Keller NC]

"Already, in just one day, I have used it successfully on adjusting some scribing as well as on a drawer. It is unbelievable. It is so much fun to use and it practically drives itself. I respect anyone who can buy an old plane and fix it up, but these new planes are something else."

Ha! Nothing like figuring out that "old timers" weren't just stuck in the past after all, eh? I remember the first time I was shown why it was a tragedy to cut up a wide, nice board into strips so that it would fit a jointer and planer, then glue it back up into a board after finishing. This was at a class a good 15 years ago. There was an older gentleman that made a good number of snorts in the back when the teacher explained this. Eventually, that afternoon turned 180 degrees with the older guy taking over an hour of the class or so and showed all of us how to dress and square a wide board with handplanes.

[Dean Karavite]

Hi David. That's a great story. Now I never ever doubted the old timers! :-) In fact just today an old timer reminded me that old timers never had 6000 grit water stones mined from some rare fossil bed in Madagascar and yet their chisels and planes were sharp as anything (okay I made that up where they come from, but you know what I mean).

Speaking of real old timers, a while back I saw a show detailing how the Greeks built the Parthenon and actually built in subtle curves throughout every part of it so that the human eye/perception would perceive it as a more perfect. They still don't know how they did it. No way, I give ALL old timers a great deal of respect!