What's up with Felder USA?

[Victor Philippi]

I Just emailed the following message to Felder USA after an interesting phone conversation (or lack thereof):


I'm getting a huge bonus at work and I've been looking into purchasing a combination sliding table saw / shaper with a portion of the money. I've been oogling over the Felder products online for quite a while now when I noticed that your East Coast offices are located right here in the same town I live in. This morning I called the 1-800 number you have posted on your web page to find out if they have a showroom here in New Castle so that I can see some of your equipment in person. I simply asked the question "do you guys have a showroom open to the public so that I can look at some of your tools?" and the guy answering the phone didn't say a word and just hung up on me. That was all I had a chance to say before your representative hung up on me.

You guys just made my decision to buy a Felder product very easy. If you aren't even going to take the time to say three words ("No we don't") to me over the phone when I ask them if you have a showroom open to the public then what makes me think you're going to take the time to stand behind your equipment if I were to buy a piece and have problems?

Good job Felder. You guys just lost an easy $8,000+ sale. All I wanted to do was look at one of your machines before I bought one. Minimax will be getting business instead.

Victor G. Philippi
Given the current economic situation, I'm really surprised that a company would be so quick to shoo off a potential customer. Granted, I'm not a business looking to purchase $50,000 - $250,000+ in equipment or with extensive plans to retool a production facility but, again, given the current economic situation businesses and individuals are seriously cutting back on discretionary spending. I'm serious about buying a piece of equipment that will last me a lifetime and, until now, I was dead set on buying a Felder machine.

On the other hand, Minimax has been great so far. All I did was fill out an email form on their website requesting information by mail and I received a phone call from their offices the next day asking me if I had any questions or if there was anything in particular I was looking for/considering. The guy was ready to talk to me all day long about their equipment - even when he found out that I was a hobbyist looking at buying some of their lower end tools.

I'm just a little disgruntled right now and thought I should spread the word.

[David G Baker]

Victor,
Are you sure you called the right phone number? I would try to find another contact source and give it another try before I burned the bridge.

[Ken Higginbotham]

Just wondering were you able to give them a rep name that was short with you and who did you send the email to?

ken

[Rod Sheridan]

Hi Victor, that seems very strange to me.

Perhaps the number was incorrect or mis-dialed.

Felder have been outstanding to deal with for me, on par with Lee Valley.

Regards, Rod.

[Victor Philippi]

I just sent the message on their "request information form" on their home page. I didn't get a representative name or anything. All I heard when I asked my question was the rustle of someone hanging up a phone. As far as the number I called, I called the 1-866-792-5288 number that is plastered on the top of their webpage for their Deleware office.

I live right down the street from their office in New Castle. I could walk to their office in 15 minutes from my house.

[Ken Higginbotham]

I'm sort of like the other guys. I wouldn't let something that could have been incidental keep me from a good pc of equipment.

ken

[Doug Shepard]

I've picked up the phone a number of times at work to make a call to discover no dial tone then hung up to try again. Then got a call back later wondering why I'd hung up on them. Never got a single ring on my end.

[Maurice Ungaro]

As has been said, it could have been a wrong number. Maybe it was the right number, but the guy answering the phone just dropped a heavy box on his foot and thought it was better to just hang up, rather than have you hear him cuss in vain. Maybe the fire alarm was just activated, and he had to hang up.

If I was going to drop $8k on a machine, I'd want some courteous soul on the other end of the line. However, at $8k, I wouldn't be so flip about who gets my business.

[Narayan Nayar]

Victor,

I have experience with two different sales people at Felder. Granted, they're both on the west coast, but I've never been in want of attention from their sales people. And as you say, no high-ticket-item salesperson in their right mind would blow off a potential sale in this economic climate.

If you had gotten a rude response, that would be another thing altogether. But I wouldn't take the nuclear option over what was probably a mishap.

If you're 15 minutes from their showroom, why don't you pop over?

[Russ Kay]

Also, remember that today is a holiday. Perhaps Felder was really closed and when the phone rang a janitor or someone picked up the phone by reflex and then realized he had no business being on the phone.

-- Russ

[James Hart]

Also, remember that today is a holiday. Perhaps Felder was really closed and when the phone rang a janitor or someone picked up the phone by reflex and then realized he had no business being on the phone.

-- Russ

+1 on Russ' response. It's a national holiday. I seriously doubt the person who answered the phone, if it actually was Felder's number, was part of their operation.

[Jason Beam]

One call went weird and your "Dead set on buying a Felder" goal is gone? Wow. You move quick. :P

I think you made a snap judgement without giving Felder half a chance. Like it or not, you're human and you could have misdialed. What was said when they answered the phone? Did they actually say "Hello?" or was there some offical greeting that told you it actually WAS Felder? Surely you're capable of misdialing, yes? :)

Try the number again ... if you can be turned off so quickly maybe you can be turned back on just as fast? :)

[Victor Philippi]

One call went weird and your "Dead set on buying a Felder" goal is gone? Wow. You move quick. :P

I think you made a snap judgement without giving Felder half a chance. Like it or not, you're human and you could have misdialed. What was said when they answered the phone? Did they actually say "Hello?" or was there some offical greeting that told you it actually WAS Felder? Surely you're capable of misdialing, yes? :)

Try the number again ... if you can be turned off so quickly maybe you can be turned back on just as fast? :)

[grumbling] yeah, you guys are right.

The guy did answer "Felder group USA" or something like that when he picked up the phone. I'll at least give it another shot before I totally write them off.

They do have awesome looking equipment...

[Joe Chritz]

I suppose you know for a fact that the guy didn't hit the wrong button or bump the phone or trip over the cord or, well you get the idea.

Suffice it to say I get lots of this in my business. You don't know what is happening unless you have all the information and made a major conclusion jump.

An email asking for clarification or a return call would have been better and likely to generate a response.

Joe

[Todd Solomon]

I've been dealing with Felder for years, and own a couple of their machines. Exceptional machinery, and good people to work with. Mini Max also makes great stuff and is good to work with, I also own an MM16. Good luck on your machinery quest. You're looking at the right brands.

[Robert Bailey]

heck mabye they just have a really bad phone system, or having major issues with a phone system. I would have been more shock that they didn't even try to call you back seeing how common it is these days. I would think most have caller ID. I always thought of shows as best place to look at and invest in what I like to call Major / pro tools. At least then you can have better chance agaisn't BS or being give a sales pitch, you can always check out other and compare and ask questions. "my two dowels worth"

[Alex Shanku]

LOL @ this!!

Sounds like a rational response.

[Dave Lehnert]

We have that new internet phone system at work. Customers tell us all the time they call and never get an answer. And I will pick up the phone and no one on the other end.

I would give them another call.

[Ben Abate]

I'm very shocked to hear you were treated like that. I have been dealing with Felder for many years and they seem to do well by me. To answer your question, yes they have a nice showroom right there in New Castle. It is usually well equipped with the newest machines. It's a good thing I don't live where you live, I'd be broke. Call again and ask for Geoff, he seems ok, I have met him once. One thing about any of these companies, they have a turnover of sales people. Too bad because I have had the pleasure of dealing with some pretty good sales guys at Felder. I wish I could remember the companies U.S CEO's name, it escapes me at this time, he also a great guy.

Here's one thing to remember about any of these large machinery companies, your not dealing with Rockler's or one of the normal catalog companies. These are large companies, they have many smaller companies in various countries that are their customers. They are more business oriented than hobbiest oriented. Not to say you as an individual are not important to them but, they are not as sensitive as we as non professionals would like them to be.

Don't let a phone call be the end all for you, if you were hoping to look at a Felder do yourself a favor and go see them. They're in your town!!!!!!

Some people think that Felder and the people who purchase them are snobs. I believe differently, I believe that they are quality machines, the people who purchase them know the difference and are willing to pay the upcharge to own them. If you ever need a better machine your next one will be a Martin, that's because your getting one of the best with a Felder and Martin is the best.

GO TALK TO FELDER,

take care
Ben

[Gary Cioni]

Try emailing andy@felderusa.com ... I made an inquiry awhile back and he was on top of the situation immediately and constantly following

[Peter Quinn]

Very surprised to hear this from Felder, I'd be inclined to think some one dropped the phone rather than inclined to believe they actively and purposefully hung up on you. I have not purchased one of there machines, but I have had several conversations with there west coast sales office and gone to an industrial show here on the east coast courtesy of them even though I indicated purchasing one of their machines is part of a five year plan for my shop (ie: I am only looking, I will not be ready to purchase for five years from now, i will also be looking at other manufactures and comparing closely). They have always been very professional and friendly, they have great knowledge of their product, and they make a GREAT product. Very well designed and executed machinery.

You owe it to your self to at least get a look at their machinery for the sake of comparison. I'd call back if they don't call you first and get some one that has not just eaten a buttered croissant on the phone to make an appointment for a visit!:D Or just make the walk down there and pound on the door! Oh, they have a good DVD where a skilled cabinet maker uses their best machine to make a walnut desk that is worth watching just for its own sake relative to the use of a euro slider.

[David Eisan]

Hello there,

That is a pretty rash response (180º turn about buying) to who knows what. I would have at least called them back. Where I work, the red "release" hangup button is right beside the red "hold" button. I had a person try to get my attention just as I was about to put the Boss's wife on hold and I hit the wrong button. Fortunately, I knew her voice and was able to get him to call her right back.

Also, I stretch my phone cord a lot reaching around for things at work. One morning I was answering the phone, but there didn't appear to be anyone on the other end. After two or three calls I realized the cord was broke. I guess I hung up on a few people.

Most people would understand that the phone is a mechanical/electrical device and does not always work as planned and not immediately jump to the conclusion they are being snubbed.

Call back.

David.

[John Thompson]

I would simply call back tomorrow when they are open as has been mentioned as I think it was a fluke of wrong number.. etc.. If I had recieved your call by mistake (and we all can hit one number wrong or the phone company can mis-direct) at my home and you ask if I had a show-room.. I would figure it for a crank call and well... hang up. :)

Call tomorrow and then post what happened...

Sarge..

[Steve Rozmiarek]

I usually deal with the west coast crew, but having talked to the east coast office twice, I can assure you that something went wrong with the call. Felder is a great brand, and Felder USA will take good care of your needs. What machine are you interested in?

[Craig McCormick]

I called Felder a few years ago about one of their machines and they called me back on a regular basis for the next few months trying to sell it to me. They were almost annoying. I asked them to quit calling me. Call them back. They will give you the attention you expected and then some.

AZCRAIG

[Larry Edgerton]

I had a bad experiance with a Felder rep in Madison Wisconsin. I made an appointment to be there at noon on a Saturday, got up in the middle of the night and drove the 5-600 miles, and no one was there and no one answered the phone. I bought SCMI seperates and am glad I did.

Needless to say there are no Felder machines in my shop.

[Leigh Betsch]

I called Felder a few years ago about one of their machines and they called me back on a regular basis for the next few months trying to sell it to me. They were almost annoying. I asked them to quit calling me. Call them back. They will give you the attention you expected and then some.

AZCRAIG

Same problem I had. I couldn't get rid of the guy. Even after I told him I bought MM stuff he still kept calling. He pretty much gave me the hard sell for a month, buy now or the price will go, you know the song and dance. Finally his boss called trying to sell me, told him I was done buying and they finally quit calling. Still get calls from Laguna.
Carefull what you ask for.

[jason lambert]

They kept bugging me then I decided to buy one of there machines I had a quote for a price and had cash in hand and was ready to go pick it up when the day before I had the rep finalised the invoice and on it was things like prep charge! I called up a bit upset since I already had budgeted it and they would not remove it or even give me a break on anything like all the accessories I was buying to subsitise it. Besides being lied to from them about known flaws in the machine and them giving other prices to other people I was still going to get it but that pushed me over the edge. They lost my sale because of a prep charge and a crummy rep not wanting to budge or work with me. There are tones of these stories on this site and other just do a search.

[Leigh Betsch]

I really would like to have a Felder or two in the stable but I sure didn't like to deal with their sales people on the west coast. In the end I bought MM and got some unbelievable upgrades at no cost to me, MM16 to a MM20, & 14" J/P to a 16". The salesman even got me a ST4 saw/shaper combo with a digital fence and rear tilt shaper when they were not being "sold" yet. I drove to Texas with a trailer and when my 14 j/p was damaged by the fork truck, and my 16MM demo machine was not ready they upgraded me to a 16 j/p and a 20MM at no cost. I didn't even have to ask, Jim just said here is what we are going to do... unbelievable.
I'm sure there are some great stories about Felder also and I'm sure their equipment is as good as MM but I've been extremely happy with my MM stuff so far. I guess the bottom line is when a person spends this kind of money they should feel good about it, and big part of that comes from how you are treated by the salesman.

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

I suspect that you either got the wrong number or something happened to the connection.
I do not believe that a sales office would hang up on a potential sale. It just sort of goes against the idea of getting paid.

[Mark Drayton]

As Ben Abate said.

As a visitor from the UK and Felder owner, I called in at the Delaware showroom a few years ago when i happened to be in the area and the staff spent a good hour showing me around and demonstrating the features of new models knowing there was never the chance of a sale. Granted, I was introduced by a moderator from the Felder Owners Group.

I've been using a Felder CF741 for more than 5 years now and remain very happy with it. Good solid machine with lots of options, bells and whistles that is capable of considerable accuracy and retains its settings and adjustments well.

Felder service both in the UK and from what I'm told also in the US can be a bit patchy. Always very friendly, polite and helpful but a bit prone to mistakes. They have always willingly corrected their mistakes - occasionally after several iterations. Occasionally they have even got an order for accessories completely correct first time!

One of the greatest assets of the brand is the independent Felder Owners Group - a Yahoo Group.

This is a very knowledgeable and friendly Group - well worth browsing the archives and asking any questions of the membership. One of the moderators lives in Chadds Ford PA which can't be far from you. I'm sure he would be happy to demo his equipment (which is the larger heavier range) and he is also well versed with all the ranges including Hammer.

Mark

[Rod Sheridan]

Any word on a resolution of the problem?

Will Felder's white knight ride to the rescue?

Will Victor purchase a saw/shaper?


Sheesh, this is better than reality TV.........Rod.

[Victor Philippi]

Any word on a resolution of the problem?

Will Felder's white knight ride to the rescue?

Will Victor purchase a saw/shaper?


Sheesh, this is better than reality TV.........Rod.

At least you guys are having fun with all of this... :D

Actually, it was more than resolved. I was too quick at the bit and kind of "feisty" the day I started this thread and definitely reacted too quick.

I have since made (positive) contact with a Felder rep and actually spent about an hour and a half getting a detailed walk-through of their machines. They had a sampling of much of their product line on the floor (a 700 series full combination machine, a 500 series full combination machine, a Hammer saw/shaper, and a couple of other higher end machines). In the back they showed me a Hammer jointer / planer combo that was being serviced (I think it was hit by a fork lift or something like that. I don't really remember the full story).

Their machines look absolutely amazing. During the walk-through they let me actually mess around with the equipment and everything moved amazingly smooth and felt solid. Even their "lower end" Hammer models looked and felt extremely solid.

As of right now, I'm still set on getting a Felder machine at some point in the near future. The only problem I have now is do I want to go ahead and pull the trigger and buy something from their Hammer line or do I want to save up for a little bit longer and get one of their 500 series combo machines? A Hammer machine will more than suit my desires, but their 500 series combo machine sure looks nice!

[Doug Shepard]

On a sort of related note: Is anybody else having trouble with their site lately? For the last couple weeks whenever I try the machine configurator screen or the See Price option I get a minor error message displayed on the screen followed by what looks like data that only Felder reps ought to be seeing. The machine locale info is permanently stuck on Mexico and nothing really works from that point forewardm either with IE7, Mozilla, or Chrome.

[Mark Bolton]

In the past week and a half we have been on the phone with a local Felder rep numerous times regarding a possible slider purchase. I have to think something odd happened in the call though having someone answer "Felder" and then hanging up is strange.

The Felder rep we dealt with (Richard Williams) was outstanding to deal with. A wealth of knowledge and even took the time to help me with some decisions on used equipment. A real upstanding guy. That said, the Felder was way out of our price range and didnt wind up happening.

My only advice in general would be to really investigate before making a decision based on "nice looking stuff". In doing over a months worth of almost full time research I cant tell you how many times independent sources would tell us "XYZ is the brand to buy" and then next 3 cabinet shops you talk to will tell you they wouldnt touch one of XYZ's saws for a million bucks. We heard this about every brand, SCM, MM, Felder, Griggio, etc.. About the only ones we didnt hear negatives about were Altendorf and Martin and unless you have serious bucks to drop for a new one those are out.

I would give them another call. The rep I dealt with is at 866-792-5288 ext 26

Mark

[Jason Beam]

Hey Victor,

You were in their showroom? Do they have more than just the one nearby me in West Sac?

[Steve Rozmiarek]

In the past week and a half we have been on the phone with a local Felder rep numerous times regarding a possible slider purchase. I have to think something odd happened in the call though having someone answer "Felder" and then hanging up is strange.

The Felder rep we dealt with (Richard Williams) was outstanding to deal with. A wealth of knowledge and even took the time to help me with some decisions on used equipment. A real upstanding guy. That said, the Felder was way out of our price range and didnt wind up happening.

My only advice in general would be to really investigate before making a decision based on "nice looking stuff". In doing over a months worth of almost full time research I cant tell you how many times independent sources would tell us "XYZ is the brand to buy" and then next 3 cabinet shops you talk to will tell you they wouldnt touch one of XYZ's saws for a million bucks. We heard this about every brand, SCM, MM, Felder, Griggio, etc.. About the only ones we didnt hear negatives about were Altendorf and Martin and unless you have serious bucks to drop for a new one those are out.

I would give them another call. The rep I dealt with is at 866-792-5288 ext 26

Mark

Watch that Richard character, he is good at seperating you from your hard earned $. Got me for a couple shaper cutters this very morning!

Doug, I have noticed in the past that the Felder website is (or was) a translated version of the Austrian website, and it always seemed a bit clunky. If you don't mind a bit of German, their other site is more reliable for just comparison shopping. Useless for the shipping I suppose though.

I did also learn this morning that the salesman that sold me my CF 741 is no longer with the company. He was in the Sacremento office, I think.

BTW, the more I use my Felder, the more I like it. Usually the stupid details of anything become apparent with time, but as of right now, nothing! Good stuff.

[Victor Philippi]

Hey Victor,

You were in their showroom? Do they have more than just the one nearby me in West Sac?

Yup. I was in their showroom in Delaware.

[Rod Sheridan]

[quote=Victor Philippi;1050537]At least you guys are having fun with all of this... :D

Actually, it was more than resolved. I was too quick at the bit and kind of "feisty" the day I started this thread and definitely reacted too quick.


quote]

Hi Victor, I'm glad to see that you took my comment the way it was meant, and I'm glad to hear that you've had a positive experience with Felder USA.

The Hammer equipment is very good, the Felder even better. Once you've owned one of the Euro machines, whether it's Felder/Hammer, MinMax etc. you'll wonder how you got along without it.

My wife always jokes that I go in the showroom, start sliding the slider back and forth on the Felder equipment in a trance like state.......Unfortunately there's some truth to that!:o

Regards, Rod.