Dovetails: Leigh vs Omni-Jig vs Incra

[Tom Overthere]

I want to be able to make "traditional-looking" dovetail joints, for drawer assembly and maybe some larger-scale external carcass joinery. I'd also like to be able to vary the spacing and be able to cut all types of dovetails (though I'm not dove-tail experienced and cannot yet describe the different types clearly...).

Having just spent hours online reviewing the incredible accuracy of Incra LS fences for router tables, I think it must be difficult to route dovetails in the end of a long piece while that piece is standing on end as it passes the cutter... Yes?

I also worry that I'll get so involved with Incra "precision" that I'll loose sight of what I really need to accomplish. ;) For example, I think those multi-layered dovetails that Incra features in their marketing are FANTASTIC!!! but I don't know when I'll ever need to do something like that - and if I start fooling with it, I'll get waaaay sidetracked.

As for Leigh vs. Omni: Is there any big difference between them in terms of quality, capabilities, ease-of-use or price? I think I'd spring for a 24" model as long as it can be outfitted/accessorized to do "everything".

Thanks,
Tom

[dan lemkin]

I just got the 24" leigh superjig. Setup is pretty easy, and to make through dovetails, the process is fairly straightforward. They do line up well, and with a steady hand are nice and snug.

You can change the width and number of tails on the superjigs, but the pin width is fixed. You need their D4R? version to adjust pin width.

Only problem I have found is that I keep blowing out splinters from some of the routed pieces... Not sure if this is a bit issue, or a technique issue, or a wood issue...

Here is the 3rd box I made... kinds shows learning curve. First was sloppy. Second had a gap because I lifted the router and chewed one of the fingers on the jig... 3rd is cleaner, but still has small gaps and a few chipped out edges...

By third box... takes about 1 minute to setup jig, and about 15-20 minutes to route all boards (including a bit change)

[Robert Parrish]

Tom, I use the Incra and there is no problem routing dovetails on long pieces. The right angle fixture clamps securely to the LS and I use a clamp to hold the work piece. You can do more than just dovetails with the Incra. I also have an Akeda jig for use without my router table. Take a look at the Akeda, it is very easy to use.

[Vince Shriver]

There's a gent that posts here frequently who has a webpage that you will find most helpful.

www.woodshopdemos.com (http://www.woodshopdemos.com)

John did a comparison some time ago of the features of the top dv jigs. One of the really nice things about John's site is that it contains lots and lots of photos (which I find invaluable). Check it out.

[Chip Lindley]

Hi Tom! I share your concern that you may become emmersed in Incra's over-engineered approach to everything they sell. First of all, Incra assumes you will have a dedicated router table to attach all their *paraphernalia* to. I do not have one, and don't plan on it! My router table is on the extension wing of my TS, and my router fence is much too straight forward for the Incra-ites. IMO the Incra stuff is akin to the ShopSmith in that much more time is spent fiddling with it than really making something useful! (IMO, mind ya')

I have used the Leigh 24" D4 since the 90s. It makes through dovetails accurately, and with ease, thanks to an excellent user manual. Two routers facilitate cutting tails and pins faster than changing bits, but that's up to you. It attaches anywhere you want it to, and can be stored when not in use.

The OmniJig is an excellent dovetail jig also. Same premise as the Leigh. Both are expensive, but you get what you pay for. If you want through dovetails which look hand-cut, choose one of these.

[Paul Johnstone]

I have the Jointech fence, which is similiar to the Incra.

One downside (which they don't really advertise) is that the wood has to be milled to specific thicknesses for their dovetailing system to work. Not a huge deal, but something to be aware of. I haven't actually made dovetails on the system yet, but I watched the DVD.

[Tom Overthere]

I have the Jointech fence, which is similiar to the Incra.

One downside (which they don't really advertise) is that the wood has to be milled to specific thicknesses for their dovetailing system to work. Not a huge deal, but something to be aware of. I haven't actually made dovetails on the system yet, but I watched the DVD.

Paul, check posts #4 and #8 in this link:
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=99598&highlight=incra

The Original Poster makes reference to Incra's own free Excel spreadsheet that will auto caluclate templates for you, based on YOUR material thickness, bit diameter, etc. The OP offers to send it to you if you email him personally. Ahhhh :o

[Tom Overthere]

Hi Tom! I share your concern that you may become emmersed in Incra's over-engineered approach to everything they sell.

Yeah, I'm easily distracted by "interesting objects" :D


First of all, Incra assumes you will have a dedicated router table to attach all their *paraphernalia* to...IMO the Incra stuff is akin to the ShopSmith in that much more time is spent fiddling with it than really making something useful! (IMO, mind ya')

I do want to set up a dedicated RT (actually might rather have a shaper, if I can swing it), but like you, the fiddler tendency is a weakness for me.
"A good man knows his limitations" - Harry Callahan in Dirty Harry

I sure would like to have .0001" precision on call, though...:confused:


I have used the Leigh 24" D4 since the 90s. It makes through dovetails accurately, and with ease...Two routers facilitate cutting tails and pins faster than changing bits...It attaches anywhere you want it to, and can be stored when not in use.

All GOOD. Thanks, Chip

[Tom Overthere]

There's a gent that posts here frequently who has a webpage that you will find most helpful.
www.woodshopdemos.com (http://www.woodshopdemos.com) John did a comparison some time ago of the features of the top dv jigs. Thanks, Vince. I'm on my way!

[Tom Overthere]

Tom, I use the Incra and there is no problem routing dovetails on long pieces. The right angle fixture clamps securely to the LS and I use a clamp to hold the work piece. You can do more than just dovetails with the Incra. I also have an Akeda jig for use without my router table. Take a look at the Akeda, it is very easy to use.Hey, Robert. I watched the Incra online video - depicting one of the LS router setups. I saw them doing exactly what you describe, but got a little suspicious upon noticing how each scene shows the guy routing a little piece of wood no longer than 8". I'll probably find some way to get an Incra LS system in addition to a Leigh or Omni or AKEDA(yow!) jig. I can see lots of uses for the Incra's exceptional dialable accuracy on a router table - in addition to making occassional amazing multi-layered dovetails. :D

Never heard of Akeda before. Went out and Googled it per your suggestion. MAN! I'm going to research that some more. Looks really interesting, and since I'm not invested in any DT jig at all yet, I'm going to spend a little time watching Akeda videos, etc.

Any idea who has the best PRICE on the Akeda 24"?

Thanks, Robert

[Tom Overthere]

I just got the 24" leigh superjig. Setup is pretty easy, and to make through dovetails, the process is fairly straightforward. They do line up well, and with a steady hand are nice and snug.

You can change the width and number of tails on the superjigs, but the pin width is fixed. You need their D4R? version to adjust pin width.

Only problem I have found is that I keep blowing out splinters from some of the routed pieces... Not sure if this is a bit issue, or a technique issue, or a wood issue...

Here is the 3rd box I made... kinds shows learning curve. First was sloppy. Second had a gap because I lifted the router and chewed one of the fingers on the jig... 3rd is cleaner, but still has small gaps and a few chipped out edges...

By third box... takes about 1 minute to setup jig, and about 15-20 minutes to route all boards (including a bit change)Dan, thanks a LOT for the great photos and first-hand advice. I'm really glad to see and hear about some of the real-world "learning curve issues". It's very helpful when my head if so full of all the "glorious woodworking perfection" depicted in the marketing of these fine, expensive tools (yeah, everybody here knows what I'm talking about :D).

On a personal note, I used to live relatively near Baltimore, and for a time, lived in Baltimore. By your picture, it appears you're either an EMT or a Firefighter. Assuming either is true, God bless you, brother. And that's a beautiful kid in your photo. Can't tell whether boy or girl, but reminds me so much of my daughter at that age - currently stationed overseas (sigh). Enjoy yours today! :D

[Ken Milhinch]

Why do you want to vary the spacing on your dovetails ? For a fraction of the cost of the Leigh and Omnijig you can buy the Porter Cable 4212 and cut perfect dovetails (evenly spaced) all day long. The wood doesn't care and nobody else will either.;)

[Robert Parrish]

Tom, You don't really need the 24" Akeda unless you are going to make large blanket chest etc. You can double up with the 16 by gluing them together.

[Al Navas]

I want to be able to make "traditional-looking" dovetail joints, for drawer assembly and maybe some larger-scale external carcass joinery. I'd also like to be able to vary the spacing and be able to cut all types of dovetails (though I'm not dove-tail experienced and cannot yet describe the different types clearly...)...
Tom,

Maybe you have not yet visited the Leigh Galleries? In case you have not, you can look in their Gallery Page (http://www.leighjigs.com/galleries.php). In the Dovetail Gallery alone, you will find through, half-blind, sliding, inlaid, angled, end-on-end dovetails. And my own, located in the Inlaid Dovetail Gallery (http://www.leighjigs.com/gallery.php?pid=1&section=15):

http://www.leighjigs.com/data/_1171057390.jpg http://www.leighjigs.com/data/_1171057494.jpg
The lid has end-one-end dovetails; the box is inlaid dovetails. You also can view all the Leigh videos at their Video Page (http://www.leighjigs.com/vids.php).








...Having just spent hours online reviewing the incredible accuracy of Incra LS fences for router tables, I think it must be difficult to route dovetails in the end of a long piece while that piece is standing on end as it passes the cutter... Yes?...
On the Leigh D4/D4r, for long pieces, it is really not much different than for shorter pieces (the photos are on my blog, a changing table I made (http://sandal-woodsblog.com/2007/11/01/a-changing-table-for-someone-special/)):

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y136/Sandal_Woods/Tables/Cuttingtailsononesidepanel.jpg

I just had to raise the D4 a little bit, and secure it properly :) :

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y136/Sandal_Woods/Tables/HadtoraisetheDTjig.jpg

And making the sliding dovetail for the partition:

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y136/Sandal_Woods/Tables/PreparingtocutslidingDTslot.jpg?t=1194388520






... I also worry that I'll get so involved with Incra "precision" that I'll loose sight of what I really need to accomplish. ;) For example, I think those multi-layered dovetails that Incra features in their marketing are FANTASTIC!!! but I don't know when I'll ever need to do something like that - and if I start fooling with it, I'll get waaaay sidetracked....
Tom,

The inlaid dovetails are a wonderful, decorative item that is limited only by your imagination. As mine show above, it takes only a little longer to make them, and is very repeatable using the Leigh jigs.







...As for Leigh vs. Omni: Is there any big difference between them in terms of quality, capabilities, ease-of-use or price? I think I'd spring for a 24" model as long as it can be outfitted/accessorized to do "everything".

Thanks,
Tom
On the Leigh D4, D4R, and the Super Jigs: All are of superb quality. The D4 and D4R give you the split finger assemblies, which allow adjustment of the pin sizes. A HUGE PLUS: Leigh's Customer Support and documentation is probably the best in the industry. And their Customer Support Page (http://www.leighjigs.com/support.php) is possibly a model on which others should be based.


.

[dan lemkin]

Dan, thanks a LOT for the great photos and first-hand advice. I'm really glad to see and hear about some of the real-world "learning curve issues". It's very helpful when my head if so full of all the "glorious woodworking perfection" depicted in the marketing of these fine, expensive tools (yeah, everybody here knows what I'm talking about :D).

On a personal note, I used to live relatively near Baltimore, and for a time, lived in Baltimore. By your picture, it appears you're either an EMT or a Firefighter. Assuming either is true, God bless you, brother. And that's a beautiful kid in your photo. Can't tell whether boy or girl, but reminds me so much of my daughter at that age - currently stationed overseas (sigh). Enjoy yours today! :D


I hope she returns soon and safe! "The Boy" is awsome, really a sweet kid. Have a girl on the way... I see all my free time disappearing ;-) I spent 8 years as EMT then Paramedic... and 2 as a Flight Doc during residency. Unique experience cruising at 155 knots 350 ft over Chicago. You know those ex-military pilots :D... Man do they get pissy when you knock the stick with your knees...

In regard to spacing the dovetails... I do think they look nicer if you can tailor the spacing to the width of the box/drawer... Additionally it permits you to have a full 1/2 tail at each edge giving more strength and better appearance. The nicer jigs, including the leigh superjig (but not the D4R) also permit single pass 1/2 blind dovetails if you want the uniformly spaced dovetails with a 10 deg bit.... so it just has more options. I concede... it is very expensive, by the time you get the jig, extra bits, and the vacuum attachment (which I do recommend)

[Jim Kountz]

Another vote for the Leigh, shop around you can probably snag a deal on a used D4 and save yourself alot of money. Go to Google and click advanced search. Type in Leigh Dovetail on the search box and then craigslist.org for the domain, this will search ALL of CL. Then just email the people and see if they have a problem with shipping. I do this all the time for smaller items.
I did see some videos ol Norm did on the new Porter Cable jig and it looks very promising but I have never used one myself. I have used the D4 and wouldnt even think of anything else personally.

[Greg Cole]

Hi Tom! I share your concern that you may become emmersed in Incra's over-engineered approach to everything they sell. First of all, Incra assumes you will have a dedicated router table to attach all their *paraphernalia* to. I do not have one, and don't plan on it! My router table is on the extension wing of my TS, and my router fence is much too straight forward for the Incra-ites. IMO the Incra stuff is akin to the ShopSmith in that much more time is spent fiddling with it than really making something useful! (IMO, mind ya').
I have a router table attached to my TS and I seem to be able to an Incra positioner and wonder fence system just fine as shown in the pic (given the router fence is in the cabinet not installed in the pic). There is a learning curve with any of these joinery systems, "fiddling" is par for the course until you get some experience with them.
If you don't know what you are talking about, save the advice for what you do. I know nothing of the Leigh, PC or Akeda jigs nor will I advise on them. There's alot of info here on them if you search for it. You'll find good and bad reivews about them all if you spend enough time researching.
Now if you really want to master dovetails and space them invariably, there's always the time tested method.;)

[Chip Lindley]

I sure would like to have .0001" precision on call, though...:confused:

??? .0001" precision? That is one ten-thousandth of an inch! That precision can only be had by surface grinding in metal working. Perhaps you meant .001" (one thousandth of an inch) That is still a very minute tolerance at the router table.

I suppose it is better to have it and seldom need it, than to *think* you need it and become OCD! But ...it ain't FREE! That amount of router table precision costs far too much for any need I have. I rather spend my Bucks where I get the most Bang!

[Narayan Nayar]

II also worry that I'll get so involved with Incra "precision" that I'll loose sight of what I really need to accomplish. ;) For example, I think those multi-layered dovetails that Incra features in their marketing are FANTASTIC!!! but I don't know when I'll ever need to do something like that - and if I start fooling with it, I'll get waaaay sidetracked.

Tom, it seems you have made your decision already, but I thought I'd chime in on this point, since Chip references it too.

I think your fear is misplaced. The thing about the Incra system is that you don't have to think of precision. For dovetails, as with every system, there is some setup you have to do (in the case of Incra, setting the router bit height, and finding the center of a board). But after that, there's really not much to mess with except moving the fence, which is made easy by the templates they supply.

I have an Incra LS-32 on my table saw with an Incra router lift (made by Jessem) and a Wonderfence. I bought it as a system, and I don't know what "paraphernalia" Chip is referring to. It's a pretty simple setup, actually, and I've used dovetailing jigs in the past.

I admit that I no longer use the Incra for dovetails, but I do use it for box joints. Same setup, same process as dovetails, just a different bit.

Anyway, just wanted to let you know that there's really not much to "distract" you with the Incra. And as someone else mentioned, it's useful for much more than dovetails.

[Paul Johnstone]

Paul, check posts #4 and #8 in this link:
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=99598&highlight=incra

The Original Poster makes reference to Incra's own free Excel spreadsheet that will auto caluclate templates for you, based on YOUR material thickness, bit diameter, etc. The OP offers to send it to you if you email him personally. Ahhhh :o

Thanks, I have emailed him. Hope the offer is still good :)

[Jeff Wright]

I have both the D4R and the Incra Wonderfence. I had never used the Leigh until last week when I was building an entertainment center with six drawers. I made a few attempts using the D4R, but was unsatisfied with the precision. I attribute it to my unfamiliarity with the jig. Maybe someday I will spend the time to make tight fitting joints. I instead used my Incra and made quick work of 24 half-blind dovetails that fit like a glove. Very happy with the results. I have used that jig for parts that were as long as 48 inches with good results. I do have the fence with the higher fence attachment. For a moment I even considered selling my D4R, but being a tool junkie I hate to see tools go out the door.

[John Lucas]

There's a gent that posts here frequently who has a webpage that you will find most helpful.

www.woodshopdemos.com (http://www.woodshopdemos.com)

John did a comparison some time ago of the features of the top dv jigs. One of the really nice things about John's site is that it contains lots and lots of photos (which I find invaluable). Check it out.

Vince I apprerciate the kind words. The direct link for the dovetail jig shootout is http://www.woodshopdemos.com/dtshoot-1.htm.


Please so not get distracted by some of my shop assistants.
http://www.woodshopdemos.com/dts-ld40.jpg

[Brian Kincaid]

Um both. I have an Incra LS super jig on my router table. Works very nicely. I also have a Leigh D4 which I have used to cut a bazillion through dovetails.

I guess I like the system of the Leigh a little better because thus far I use it exclusively for dovetails.

The Incra positioner system is awesome though. I love it as a router fence, it has a split fence like a shaper that is very easy to adjust to get low clearance for different bits. The dovetail stuff (vertical sled, etc) has been collecting dust for a while because I like the Leigh.

I'm sure there will be some operations later on and I will think "hmmm this would be easier on the router table" For example, I'm considering some sliding dovetails on a new project, and while the Leigh advertises this capability, I think it will be much easier on the Incra.

Brian

[Al Navas]

...
I'm sure there will be some operations later on and I will think "hmmm this would be easier on the router table" For example, I'm considering some sliding dovetails on a new project, and while the Leigh advertises this capability, I think it will be much easier on the Incra.

Brian
Brian,

I am curious on this particular item. Will the Incra be able to do sliding dovetails on large carcase pieces, such as the tail sockets for this partition for this cabinet? - it is a 22-inch long sliding dovetail socket, about 17 inches from the nearest edge - the actual setup:

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y136/Sandal_Woods/Tables/PreparingtocutslidingDTslot.jpg?t=1194388520

I simply centered the router bit on the vertical tail, and cut the sliding socket in one pass.

Or, as I have envisioned it in the past, do the work pieces stand vertically on the Incra jig? I am asking more out of ignorance than anything else... :o


.

[Greg Cole]

Hiya Al, if the router table is big enough to support the panel there should be no issue with cutting that sliding DT shown. Might want to cut it before the DT's on each end though. And given that panels size, I'd not do the DT's on my Incra setup.
As mentioned above, larger panels and such are not the forte of the Incra. You can do them with it, but it's not ideal as the "sled" you slide on the fence isn't large enough to support such a large panel well. It's a case of bringing the work to the tool or tool to the work when you boil it down.
I've used my Incra for DT's on pieces 12" wide and 24" long quite handily. Bigger than that will start getting a little more difficult or harder to manage as you move the stock not the tool.
$0.02 donation.

[Charles Robertson]

In most cases, the best dovetail jig is the one you own and are familiar with. I'm no exception. Thanks in part to a review by a fellow Creeker, a Mr. J. Lucas, I took the leap and got the Akeda-24". It's everything he said. I use mine with two Fein-1800's, 3&1/4hp=plunge. Because I had them. They are very smooth and fairly quiet. On the Akeda jig there is no stability problem. A set of smaller fixed base routers would be preferred, but not required. The 1/8" variable spacing has never been an issue, in fact I believe I may prefer it for positive, lock-in repeatability. Research all your reviews. Thanks again, Mr. Lucas, I love my Akeda. A

[Dan Bertenthal]

I also purchased the Leigh Superjig instead of the top of the line D4R and am quite pleased. The instructional video is quite good and I got tight dovetails on my first practice run.

Dan already mentioned the limitation of the pins being a fixed width, though the pins are fairly narrow as was traditional, and you said that's what you're looking for. Handcut dovetails often have even narrower pins, though I doubt any dovetail jig can go narrower since the router bit's shank needs a certain minimum diameter for strength.

You're also limited with the Superjig to 3/4" stock or narrower, which may or may not be a dealbreaker.

As for the tearout, there are some tricks. The video shows you how to route the pins in a specific sequence that improves things quite a bit. I believe you can also use backerboards of waste wood as extra insurance, though I've never tried it (I imagine it would complicate the setup a bit). I suspect that tearout is a problem with any through-dovetail jig, not just Leigh's.

A last thought is to consider their vacuum and router support accessory, which is spendy but works really well.

All in all, Leigh did a pretty good job with the Superjig in bringing down the price and still keeping most of the functionality as the D4R.

Dan B

[David Moody]

One good thing about the new Omnijig or the D4R, as compared to the Superjig, is that the extra stock capacity beyond 3/4" allows you to easily put in sacrificial wood to reduce the tear out. I like extra capacity in any tool if it gives you flexibility. There are some other benefits, obviously, but that is a practical example that I have run into already when I was working with some BB (and yes, I scored the bottom edge of the cut beforehand, also!).

I use the PC Omnijig myself and it has made making dovetails waaayyy too easy. It is a slick design and makes consistent, repeatable cuts. It is also easy to make finite adjustments with predictable results.

[Jim Eller]

What Charles Robertson said.

Jim

[Jacob Mac]

I really like my Incra setup. It is really easy to use and you get very nice results. As I progress in my WW, I think I will move to doing a lot more with hand tools, but for now, the Incra is great.

I'm sure the other systems you mentioned are really nice too, but don't assume the Incra is difficult or time consuming, because it is pretty straight forward. But I'm pretty sure you can't make a bad choice with any of the systems you mentioned.

[Tom Overthere]

It took me FOREVER to get back to this thread. Not because I'm so busy, but because I've been afraid to return. I figured there'd be TONS of solid information/advice going in all different directions. I was right.

I also figured the advice would force me to launch a big-time research project (crusade, really) to try to sort it all out, as it pertains to my work habits / skills / budget. Again, I was right...and oh, my aching head.

With so many diverse, well-defended perspectives it's not easy figuring which expensive system to buy (and considering the ultimate costs, I expect I'll live with my choice for a long, long time).



Thanks to you all. I read and benefitted from every comment, and I have to say :D this thread has EVERYTHING(!) in it:


So which DT jig will I buy? It'll be the Leigh D4R or maybe the PC Omni 24". And I hope to find an Incra 17" LS at a good price for use on the router table.

CHIP LINDLEY, you're right, .0001" is one-TEN-thousandth of an inch. Justa a typo (maybe a wishful typo).

AL NAVAS, you make a helluva good case for Leigh (and your shop is beautiful). Thanks for making such a thoughtful post. I visited your Sandal Wood site and enjoyed your Changing Table project very much. I also looked around the Leigh site - galleries, inlaid DTs and vids. Yep, you're right.

JIM KOUNTZ, who'd imagine I'd learn to do better Google research here at a woodworking forum. Thanks.

DAN LEMKIN, you're a lucky man. Thanks for the glimpse into a life well lived.

ROBERT PARRISH, thanks for cluing me in to the AKEDA jig. Never heard of it before. Spent an hour or so last week studying up online, and will definitely look some more before I pull the trigger.

VINCE SHRIVER > JOHN LUCAS, thanks for introducing me to WoodshopDemos.com. John, I'm recently divorced, and when I figure out where you're located, I'M MOVING THERE :eek:! I never saw attractive women involved in woodworking before (might lose a finger or two with such distractions, though...)

PAUL JOHNSTONE, thanks, but due to my lack of knowledge re. DT joinery, I'll have to stick with the well-established options.

KEN MILHINCH, I sure appreciate somebody trying to help me save money, but in the long run, I think being able to adjust spacing will be a real benefit to me.

GREG COLE, I'm determined not to put a RT in my TS extension. I'm sick of having to knock down one set-up so I can prep the next operation. I want to keep everything separate as much as possible - put machines on rollers and wheel out what I need, already set up. :D Ahhhhhh.

CHARLES ROBERTSON, rock on! You know the old saying, "Beware the man who owns a single gun" (as he's very familiar with it). I take your point about the repeatability benefits of the Akeda. Gonna have to take another look at that...

DAN BERTENTHAL, thanks for the rundown on Leigh limitations. I always like to know what isn't so great when making important decisions. I will probably buy D4R (or Omni or Akeda) so hope to avoid some of the specific limiations you mention. Thanks.

DAVID MOODY, it's :mad:people like you:mad: who make a lot of extra work for :eek:people like me:eek:. I was all ready to start searching Craig's List (per Jim's technique) for a D4R deal, and now I have to spend several more nights learning online about the OmniJig (and the Akeda, too, actually). I knew coming back to this thread meant trouble! :D of course I'm just kidding with you

JIM ELLER, what I said about Charles Robertson (see above)

JACOB MAC, I know the Incra can provide the same accuracy as my milling machine (for metal) does. I'm just thinking it'll be a lot easier to work large wood pieces in one of the dedicated DT jigs. The Icra LS 17" fence will be FANTASTIC on the router table for lots of uses, though - including specialized DTs if needed. Thanks.

If I failed to reply to anyone, I apologize. You guys are extremely helpful, and assure you I carefully read every word of your posts. THANKS very much, and I'll let you know what I end up with - or maybe I'll have to come back here and ask even MORE questions before I can decide...:D

[Paul Murphy]

Hi Tom, looks like you asked the right questions, and got some great answers!

I have had the Leigh 24" jig (D-1258R back then) for over 15 years. I still remember one difficulty the manual mentioned in passing, and that was the need to get the guide bushing accurately centered around the router bit. Essential, but how??? Took me a while to track that down!

Well, various companies make a cone that ends in a shaft chucked into the router, which will then center the guide bushing about the shaft/cone. A variation is some bushings have a shaft machined to the I.D. of a specific guide bushing (a specialty item).

Anyhow, this drove me nuts because the manual at the time didn't really address HOW to center the guide bushing, and any error in concentricity can result in twice as much mating error. This applies to almost any jig or operation referencing opposite sides of the router guide bushing (or base plate).

I do like the Leigh for many reasons, one being that it adapts to different wood thicknesses and joint layouts. Good luck with your choice!

http://www.woodcraft.com/product.aspx?ProductID=147853&FamilyID=20151 (http://www.woodcraft.com/product.aspx?ProductID=147853&FamilyID=20151)

http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=32316&cat=1,180,42311,42321 (http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=32316&cat=1,180,42311,42321)

http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=18895&filter=router%20centering (http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=18895&filter=router%20centering)

http://woodhaven.com/ProductDetail.asp?Id=2264 (http://woodhaven.com/ProductDetail.asp?Id=2264)

http://www.ptreeusa.com/routerAcc.htm (http://www.ptreeusa.com/routerAcc.htm)
No.2908

http://www.jaspertools.com/productsdetail.cfm?SKU=Model375&prod=Model-735%20Centering%20Pin&cat=Centering%20Pin (http://www.jaspertools.com/productsdetail.cfm?SKU=Model375&prod=Model-735%20Centering%20Pin&cat=Centering%20Pin)

[Tom Overthere]

Thanks, Paul.

I might have overlooked that important consideration entirely. I appreciate your help in avoiding "mystery gaps" in my dovetailing learning curve.

And thanks very much for including the clarifying links.

The centering pin at this link seems like the best approach for me:
http://www.ptreeusa.com/routerAcc.htm (http://www.ptreeusa.com/routerAcc.htm) No.2908