Miter Saw Help Needed

[Richard Madison]

Usually am on the turners' forum, but this seems a better place for my questions. Considering purchase of a non-sliding miter saw to make smooth, vertical cuts (cutting segments for woodturning), and need some advice please. Ease and accuracy of setting and holding the miter angle would be important. Are all brands pretty much the same, or are some clearly better than others? So far have only looked at the DeWalt DW715 and its older version, the DW705, but am sure there must be equally good saws out there. Have an old RAS that does that kind of cutting, but not perfectly smooth, flat, perfectly mitered cuts. Considering the accuracy required, would a 10" saw be better than a 12"? Please help, and thanks in advance.

[Jim Kountz]

For cutting segs you want a 10" non sliding saw. A 12" saw will introduce some (although minimal) wobble over a 10". The Dewalts you listed there are both good, take a look at Bosch and also Makita. I have several Dewalts and like them alot. I had a Hitachi and returned it, was the biggest POS I ever had. But others here love them. I got a lemon.

[Paul Demetropoulos]

Don't chuck your RAS just yet, most can be set up to to cut with extreme accuracy. The trick is to set the saw to make a very accurate 90 degree straight cut and leave it there, and move the wood for miters.

You'd make a simple jig the butts up to the RAS fence and holds you stock at a 45 degree angle to the fence. The cuts are accurate and very fast.

That said I have a Makita 10" chop and Makite 10" slider, both are great.
I just like using my RAS, I don't know why but I find it more fun, whatever sense that makes. (Insert comic queston mark face)

[Richard Madison]

Thanks Jim and Paul. The new saw would be an addition, not a replacement for the RAS. It still does several things well, but is not sufficiently rigid to make the kinds of cuts that I want.

[Joe Chritz]

If you have a tablesaw a miter sled is cheaper and just as accurate, normally more so.

Miter saws can be touchy to get the angle set just right. Once set they generally hold that very well barring some outside influence. If you only need a handful of angles a sled is a front runner to the ideas.

Joe

[Ed Hazel]

Not to steal your thread but I have been looking at the new Milwaukee 6950-20 12" Dual-Bevel Compound Miter Saw have not found much on them yet maybe someone here has one and can comment on accuracy and dust collection.

[Sonny Edmonds]

I approched segments from a different angle when I was playing with my glue ups. Maybe it can help.
I got router bits to make the specific angles (http://www.rockler.com/CategoryView.cfm?Cat_ID=288)for the segments. I would run the wood along the bits in my router table, then slice off the numbers of pieces needed so I could glue them up into rings.
All it required was a 90 degree cut, the chamfer is done already.
I still used my SCMS to do the 90's. But it went like this:

Test run with MDF:
http://home.earthlink.net/~pie/images/segmented%20turnings/fba1.jpg

http://home.earthlink.net/~pie/images/segmented%20turnings/fba4.jpg

http://home.earthlink.net/~pie/images/segmented%20turnings/fba5.jpg
__________________________________________________ _____________

And it winds up like dis:
http://home.earthlink.net/~pie/images/segmented%20turnings/fbaw15.jpg


http://home.earthlink.net/~pie/images/segmented%20turnings/fbaw16.jpg

http://home.earthlink.net/~pie/images/segmented%20turnings/fbaw7.jpg

http://home.earthlink.net/~pie/images/segmented%20turnings/fbaw8.jpg
__________________________________________________ ____________
Basically, there are lots of ways to skin a cat.
My way got rid of the bother of figuring angles accurately for the segments and allowed me to focus on the content of the pieces.
The individual layers (rings) are glued up on waxed paper on my TS suface so I can flatten them on the side I glue to the turning. Then it gets turned true to the whole. And the next layer is glued to it.
For me it worked better than making an entire form and trying to turn that. ;)

__________________________________________________ ____________

Jim, feel free to move this to the turning forum if you wish. :)

[Larry Edgerton]

Hey Sonny

You're shop is a mess!

Looks just like mine.:(

[Gene Howe]

For segments,you might try one of these: miterset.com

[Gene Howe]

For segments try these: http://miterset.home.comcast.net/~miterset/index.html:o

[Richard Madison]

Thanks again for taking time to reply. I appreciate it. Have been using sleds on a table saw for some years, but just researching whether there is a better way. The router bit seems like a good way for small numbers of pieces, but I wonder about continuing sharp cuts when doing many hundreds or even thousands of segments. And Gene, linky no work.

Have decided to clean my 80 tooth Freud and snug up the sled runners before spending $$ I'd rather not on a tool that maybe I don't really need.

Again, thanks for replying, as you have definitely helped clarify my sometimes fuzzy thought process.

[Jim Watts]

For segments try these: http://miterset.home.comcast.net/~miterset/index.html:o

This one works better:

http://home.comcast.net/~miterset/index.html

[Richard Madison]

That's a cool tool Jim and Gene. And/but must say that there will be some "slop" (for want of a better word) between the tool and the miter bar, and some additional "slop" between the miter bar and the miter slot in the table saw. However, since the slop will typically not all be biased in one direction, the results are probably pretty good, especially for a polygon with few sides, maybe 4, 6, or 8.

All that said, recall that my concern was not with angle, but with a clean, flat cuts. My sleds are adjustable for angle with paper shims .004" thick, which translates to .1 or .2 degrees of angle, and useless if you have "sled slop" in the miter slots. Consider a ring of a segmented piece with only 12 segments, all cut 0.1 degrees too large (or small) on both sides of each segment. That is a total error of 2.4 degrees, which could be a visible gap (depending upon the method of assembly). On the other hand ---

Oops, yammering again. Thanks again guys. Appreciate your help.

[Gene Michael]

Richard, there's a lot of good info in the responses, but I didn't see anything on the Dewalt 713 MS. My wife got me one for Christmas and I really like it. The 713 is a basic model without table extensions or a table mounted clamp. What it does have is a wealth of adjustments, though mine was almost perfectly aligned right out of the box. It has plenty of power, a smooth electric brake and has done everything I've asked of it. Sells at the borgs and Sears for about $220. :)

[Richard Madison]

Thanks Gene. I missed the 713 also in my research. Looks like a good quality but basic saw, which is exactly what I was wanting. Will keep it in mind.

[Sonny Edmonds]

Hey Sonny

You're shop is a mess!

Looks just like mine.:(

One man's mess is another man's organized chaos. :p
That was the old shop. The new shop is much better! :D

http://home.earthlink.net/~pie/images/mess/mess_2.jpg

http://home.earthlink.net/~pie/images/mess/mess_1.jpg




Hon? You seen my pencil? :)

[Joe Chritz]

You can fix all slop with runners (I haven't ever had an issue but multiple cuts definitely compounds the problem) with a steel runner bar, one from UHMW or by using a regular maple runner and sticking a few screws in the side for adjustments.

With a metal bar you would likely need access to a surface grinder unless it was very close to final size to start. The others obviously can be worked easily with what most of us have on hand.

Wouldn't cutting on opposite sides of the jig counter some of the compounding angle problem? Say for a 8 sided shape one cut is 22.6 the other would be 22.4.

Joe