Woodworking & the bad economy... [Archive] - Sawmill Creek Woodworking Community

Shawn Christ

01-09-2009, 1:28 PM

Like Matt, I too am a weekend hobbyist with (knock on wood) a stable, full-time job. As long as I have that job and the accompanying paychecks, my woodworking hobby will not be affected. I would guess that stability of employment is probably the largest factor for most hobbyists.

That said, my wife and I are not taking on any more debt and have delayed major house projects, like finishing our basement, for another year or two just to see how the economy pans out. We just don't know what could happen. My dad (54) is still a full-time carpenter but just got laid off from his company. Unfortunately his woodworking hobby won't pay the bills. It's tough out there for some people.

Dave Lehnert

01-09-2009, 1:30 PM

I am in the middle of the road about things. On one hand I am afraid to spend, may need the money down the road. But on the other hand Money I had invested in stocks is gone so I should just have spent the money on myself for tool and not give it to some CEO to give away.

Vince Shriver

01-09-2009, 1:43 PM

Good question, Jason. My thought is that new construction is probably way down, i.e. cabinet shops making and installing new fixtures in new homes and business, but that the remodel market may compensate for some of this lean-time economy. Interesting to see how folks here that make a living in the trades are doing.

Anthony Whitesell

01-09-2009, 2:08 PM

Luckily I made my big tool purchases before the end of the year with the aid of Microsoft, so the credit card hit isn't too bad. Based on the timing, it appears that I bought and paid for two tools and Microsoft bought my christmas gifts for everyone (as the cashback via PayPal will pay off this months charges, the christmas gifts).

I am definately not going to be purchasing any new tools. I'm trying to avoid buying accessories and saving my cash for the disposables and consumables (sandpaper, blades, wood, hardware, etc.). Even the disposable purchases I'm trying to minimize.

Todd McGeachy

01-09-2009, 2:10 PM

I think it is going to be a very painful few years ahead for us, especially since no-one knows how bad things really are. Much of the debt is private…so this is going to be a long year of unhappy disclosure...

If you have no little or no debt and a stable job you will be in great shape as the retailer try to lower their stocked goods and bargain priced used gear abounds; especially a year from now when it hits folks that this isn’t going to be a dip, this is a reset of a flawed economy. Too many businesses were servicing industries built on unlimited credit...this is going to be industrial and retail Darwinism...

Most craftsmen should be alright in the higher end market, some people always have money to spend. It's the low end that will take the hit as those with limited disposable money pull back.

I am seeing this now at work, this is the slowest Christmas in 26 years I am told.

The thing I have noticed is that prices are going UP on new tools and equipment in some cases as well. I've noticed a jump of a couple of hundred per item on stationary tools in the last couple months. I wonder if that is because quantity sales are dropping and overhead is increasing. This may show who can last in this market, because obviously that isn't helping.

So good used tools are going to be around and wood should be easier to find from people supplementing their income...good for hobbyists.

This is going to hurt production shops though. Suppliers may dry up and such. The little guys doing things for neighbors and so on will be ok, but I wouldn't want to have a staff... But as always, the smart, the talented and especially the lucky will get by.

Jason Whitaker

01-09-2009, 2:29 PM

Truly interesting topic..

As someone who lost his day job in Dec, but is fortunate enough to be in a good position I am in the beginnings of starting up my own little shop. I have not even finished yet and I have 4 large pieces of furniture and several smaller items already on "order" with a few deposits. So it is always interesting to see where /who has the money and what they are willing to spend it on. I think people who are in a decent position are still willing to spend their money, but more than ever I talk to people who want quality..which might help some smaller craftsmen , just my current observation The Used tool market has some great deals right now, though I am still curious to see where it may go. Locally, I know several relators who have never moved as many houses as they are right now, so I guess it all depends on where you are. I think there is a lot of difference from locality to locality...state to state...region to region. I certainly wish everyone here all the best in getting through these lean times.

Joseph Hadley

01-09-2009, 2:37 PM

As the crisis seems to be based, in large part, on the failure of several industries that don't actually make anything of lasting value (banks, mortgage brokers, Madoff who made off with the money, appraisers....in short, the monetary vulture crowd, I have found that when I enter the shop to work on something with my bare hands, and arrive at something of which I am even a little bit proud...even if it is just an amazing pile of shavings....I feel better that I am working in the real world, in real time, as opposed to an imaginary construct based on taking advantage of people's needs and/or greed.

It is deeply regrettable that so many, with no hand in the orchestration of this chaos, have been blindsided and have lost so much.

I find that I am building and contributing more things I have made to fundraisers for the community and for schools.

In terms of tool purchases, I am seeing that more cabinet shops are going under, and I see more industrial weight heavy metal for sale....mostly 3 phase gear, or things that I can't shoehorn into my shop for lack of space, or things that I probably couldn't figure out how to use.

Jeff Duncan

01-09-2009, 3:09 PM

Last month I spent a little over $3k on a new machine and new cutters for the shaper. This spring I'll hopefully be bringing in a vertical panel saw. Between now and then though I'm going to be a little more careful with my spending.
People with money are still spending and I'm working extra hours right now to keep up with the demand, at least while it lasts. But you just never know when things might dry up so I'll be stashing a little extra away just in case.
Jason, I wish you luck as this is probably the worst time to try to make it with custom furniture. The good thing is if you can start up and survive in this economy, you'll do great once it turns around:D
good luck,
JeffD

Justin Leiwig

01-09-2009, 3:31 PM

I don't know...I'm on the fence. I've been buying some things, but never with credit, and never over $100 at a time (except for the tablesaw I bought used at $160). I'm also trying to pay down my debt. I'm starting to follow the Dave Ramsey FPU series. I've got my $1000 in the bank, and I'm going to be putting extra towards my credit card payments every month to pay them off hopefully by the end of this year.

However, I'm worried about job stability. Admittedly I work for the government, but if tax revenues continue to fall like they have for the past three years, then I could be laid off. I've been told by the bigwhigs that we are in good financial shape for 2009, but if there is something major that happens that all goes out the window.

If I lost my job now, there is no way I think I would be able to keep my house, and that keeps me up at night. I'm trying to do things to keep things in check, like planning a bigger garden, canning and preserving. I'm also conserving what I can, but not severely.

Rod Sheridan

01-09-2009, 3:45 PM

Strictly a hobby guy, however I work in a fairly stable job, almost all my children have left home, and I don't have any debts.

I'm looking at a new saw/shaper combo, and may purchase it in February, even though the Canadian dollar is down.

If everyone stops buying, we'll create our own massive downturn in the economy. To me, much of the media talk seems to foster this, which reminds me of the anecdote about the hot dog vendor.

One thing in my favour is that the Canadian economy hasn't been hit as hard as others, (yet?).

Regards, Rod.

glenn bradley

01-09-2009, 3:55 PM

I am just a hobbyist. I would starve if I had to make a living at this; I'm too slow. I am however, enjoying the current economic impact on our providers. If you look around and know what you want, there are some great deals out there. Folks are looking to move stock. Take advantage of it if you can.

So I guess my purchasing is actually way up from normal. If only I could find a 70% off, everything must go, clearance on Honduran mahogany ;-)

Todd McGeachy

01-09-2009, 4:05 PM

hmm there is a thought. I went down to Nicaragua last year and toured some furniture factories, beautiful stuff. I have the pictures here if anyone wants to take a peek. You should have seen the huge logs of heartwood set aside for table pedestals :) They consider mahogany a weed :D

The owner showed my all the different woods they had access to, there were dozens! Anyway my thought is: I wonder what it would cost to fill a container and send it up here?

Eric Schniewind

01-09-2009, 4:08 PM

I'm a hobbyist and am just putting together my first shop which i've wanted for about 8 years now. Had to move to do it. I had money invested in the stock market which i had earmarked for getting set up with bigger tools. That money has decreased in value by a sizable chunk reflective of the general market. It has made me make different decisions on buying tools. I have bought some tools on Craigslist but even though there may be more used tools on the market, there are also more buyers. So some things must be bought new. I tried to get a Grizzly DC before the end of the year but they back ordered it and now have raised prices so I bought something else on sale. I just made a very simple workbench and economics drove the choices I made on materials.

Bottom line is that it is affecting my purchases but it's not killing all purchases.

I'm currently contemplating putting more cash into the stock market this year. It may not be this year or even the next but I have to believe that there will be some big gains somewhere down the line.

Best of luck to everyone. If only there was big money in sawdust.

Steve Clardy

01-09-2009, 4:18 PM

Still buying what I need to buy.

Work is still coming in.

Having problems collecting final payment on a couple of recent jobs though.
Bank cut them off from the funds to pay me off. :(

John Ricci

01-09-2009, 4:29 PM

I may just be one of the more fortunate ones playing the ww game in that my wife and I opened a retail store in 07 (arguably the worst possible time) dealing in antiques, vintage housewares, collectibles etc. as well as my woodworking and her custom sewing efforts. We live in an area that is seasonally inhabited by cottagers/skiers living in $1m+ "recreational homes" and as others have said, these folks just don't stop spending:eek: We have been building a reputation through our work and store as the local "go to" for custom work and unique finds that you won't see at "the mall". The retail store is the real exposure for us and I don't think we could do nearly as well as we have been without it...the economy worsens and our sales figures keep going up???

Right now I'm stuck at home getting a website set up for the store so that we can reach more people, increase sales and hopefully start to employ other people in a place that has seen two major manufacturers fold recently...one making furniture and the other that made shoes. A lot of those folks who lost their jobs were 2nd income farmers who needed the work to make ends meet so it would be nice in time to give some jobs back to the community where we can.

Tool purchases? I don't spend a lot on tools, save for the General 650R I bought last summer. Most of my stuff is old, well built machinery that should outlive me and all of it is up to the task of making fine sawdust:D When I find I need a new machine I think, research, decide and then argue over a price until I get what I want...or find a way to work without it "for now".

We certainly do have a few interesting years ahead of us as far as where the global financial situation will wander but be assured, those of us with talents to produce products will find our services in demand from a "can you fix...?" to "I need these two walls with floor to ceiling pantry cabinets" (I have two of those right now) etc. Keep in mind that what we do with wood is as much a mystery as neurosurgery to a lot of people so why not let it help feed you? Enough of my ranting now!

J.R.

Dewayne Reding

01-09-2009, 4:31 PM

Just returned from my hardwood dealer. A small operation in western Illinois. She said their business was better than expected. I overheard a few of their customers remarking they were amazed their business was still brisk. They were furniture and cabinet makers. I suppose it will set in slower in some parts of the country. The hardwood dealer has very competitive prices, so perhaps they are drawing customers that are now willing to travel a little ways for a better deal?

Gene Howe

01-09-2009, 4:58 PM

No debt, home paid for, steady and secure income, I'll be buying tools as needed.

We'll be flying to Hawaii, Japan and Okinawa within the year. That may curtail some purchases for a while.

Cary Falk

01-09-2009, 5:32 PM

Well, our situation is not looking so hot. We have been forced to take large paycuts due to reduced work hours and uypayed vacations. We have severely cut our expenses. No spending is happening unless it is a life or death situation. I wanted to buy a couple of tools this year but that probably won't happen. My woodworking hobby is partially funded by side projects that have also dried up. If we both make it through the announced layoffs that will be happening on the 19th this year might be slightly better then a disaster.

Don Bullock

01-09-2009, 7:18 PM

I retired last year and my wife retires in June. Our retirement income will be good, secure and steady. Still I don't plan to buy a lot of equipment. I bought most of my large machines over the past three years before many of the recent price increases. For the most part I'm set with tools. My wife and I purchased a home for our retirement and had a shop/garage built next to it. Our only problem with the economy will be selling our present home. On paper we've lost quite a bit, but it is still worth far more than we paid and invested in it. Considering that the home we bought was a foreclosure the paper "loss" on our present home won't be as big as it could have been. I plan to enjoy life as much as possible despite the "state of the economy."

Peter Quinn

01-09-2009, 8:06 PM

I work for a medium sized custom millwork shop dealing mostly in high end work, i.e. for people in the wealthy to stupid rich category. Things are definitely slower than they were two years ago but we are still fully employed. Overtime has been cut out, but this didn't affect me as I wasn't taking any when it was available, preferring to spend my extra hours in my own shop or with my family. There are tons of bids being given and estimates for work being done, and there are deposits on numerous jobs without definite start/finish dates. Flooring and molding orders are off considerably, which means orders now take three to four weeks to fill rather than 6 weeks to 4 months. Not dead but eerily quiet. The contractors we deal with indicate that things are slow but again not dead stopped. This is typically the slowest point of the year even in a strong economy.

I am working on a set of garden furniture pieces that my boss put in the pocket so to speak early this fall, opting to start in the middle of the winter when other things slow down for a spring delivery date. Being the junior cabinet maker on staff I will be the first to know if layoffs are happening should things get slower.:eek: But I sleep well at night knowing my debt is low, my credit cards are paid off and my home shop is well equipped and paid for. Remember the parable of the ant and the grasshopper? I am an ant.

I have a commission to build a desk in my own shop that I have been designing slowly and should start building soon. A few weeks forced vacation this winter would be a godsend at this point. I have turned down other work that I simply cannot produce in my off hours. I considered but opted not to try and work full time under my own name this spring and am now glad I didn't but certainly wood should the need arise. I did establish a business entity and set up an LLC that I can begin working under when or if necessary.

As far as tool purchases for the home shop I am on a earn it then buy it basis at this point. I have everything I need to work wood and then some save a few cutters and bits that I will continue to buy on a when on sale or as actually needed basis. There are lots of things I want, in fact the list is endless. I would love to get a big euro band saw and a new planer, but that won't be happening until I sell some work with the things I have now, more due to a commitment to stem my tool addiction than the economy.

Remember, a 7% unemployment rate means that 93% of people are STILL employed minus those that have stopped looking, a figure I do not know but always baffles me about government statistical analysis. I hope they start laying off some members of the press and television soon; I understand the news must be reported but they seem to relish in economic bad news. It comes through in their vocal inflections on television and gross repetition of the same statistics in print.

Noah Vig

01-09-2009, 8:15 PM

Not much different for me (hobbiest, secure job) and have switched to emphasis on getting shop setup rather than tools. Been procrastinating. Going to have house upgraded to 200 amp service first.

Larry Edgerton

01-09-2009, 8:24 PM

Most craftsmen should be alright in the higher end market, some people always have money to spend. It's the low end that will take the hit as those with limited disposable money pull back.
.

Not so here. My clients are the upper crust, and at least here in Michigan they have pulled in their horns. No one is spending anything. Over 90% of the carpenters in my town that were working 4 years ago are laid off or have moved. I RAN OUT OF WORK YESTERDAY! First time, ever! I have nothing of note in the pipeline other than some gun room cabinets, a 1 week job, alone.

I am looking at buying a motel in Montana, but that too is a scary proposition, because the cancer that started here is spreading.

But on the up side, I may get my own kitchen done.......:)

Karl Brogger

01-09-2009, 8:41 PM

If you're a pro, are you without customers/clients?

Yep, I had to go get a fricken job. I HATE working regular hours.

Jason Whitaker

01-09-2009, 8:47 PM

Not so here. My clients are the upper crust, and at least here in Michigan they have pulled in their horns. No one is spending anything. Over 90% of the carpenters in my town that were working 4 years ago are laid off or have moved. I RAN OUT OF WORK YESTERDAY! First time, ever! I have nothing of note in the pipeline other than some gun room cabinets, a 1 week job, alone.

I am looking at buying a motel in Montana, but that too is a scary proposition, because the cancer that started here is spreading.

But on the up side, I may get my own kitchen done.......:)

I don't disagree at all Larry, rather that is my point about how different areas of the country have been affected quite differently. I cant presume to know about your town, but I certainly know that Michigan as a whole has been in the news for financial woes long before this whole worldwide mess even got rolling. Have a friend who lives in Detroit...and well needless to say he is looking at making a return to Northern NJ.

Jim Becker

01-09-2009, 8:57 PM

No real change from "planned"...I'm picking up high-quality used hand tools here and there and had no major expenditures in the works for the shop anyway. And I'm getting time in the shop to work, too, which means I'll have less lumber to move upstairs when I relocate the rack one of these days. :)

I'm being a little more conservative on "disposable income" expenditures these days, but not excessively so. It's either for woodworking or equestrian activities when it does get spent, however...

Dave Lehnert

01-09-2009, 9:01 PM

No debt, home paid for, steady and secure income, I'll be buying tools as needed.

..............And you own a Shopsmith that will never quit. Life is good. LOL!!!

Steve Griffin

01-09-2009, 11:20 PM

Not so here. My clients are the upper crust, and at least here in Michigan they have pulled in their horns. No one is spending anything. Over 90% of the carpenters in my town that were working 4 years ago are laid off or have moved. I RAN OUT OF WORK YESTERDAY! First time, ever! I have nothing of note in the pipeline other than some gun room cabinets, a 1 week job, alone.

I am looking at buying a motel in Montana, but that too is a scary proposition, because the cancer that started here is spreading.

But on the up side, I may get my own kitchen done.......:)

+1 on upper class clients-- I think the economy is hurting them far worse than anyone else. Most of my business has been the very wealthy. Now, that is all but dried up.

Luckily I'm getting more upper middle class remodel work.

Folks with good income who still have jobs are not wanting to give it away to stocks or real estate, vacations or luxury items. So with cash building up, they are remodeling.

Looks like I have at least 4 months of work for my shop. If nothing happens after that, it's time to get our addition done and some camping vacations in. Sounds pretty good actually...

-Steve

Kelly C. Hanna

01-09-2009, 11:34 PM

Todd...love to see pics of that excursion!

Steve...very sorry to hear that my friend...here's a few positive waves for you~~~~~~

As for me...my business is still good but there are a few speedbumps on the horizon. There is a delay at the ranch which forces me to keep on the beaten path of what I have been doing up until now. No real problem with that other than the lack of new business calls. I have about 4 weeks of work IF I lay off the last of three employess which will happen next week.

Good news is that both current jobs might lead to a few more with the same clients...as long as I produce what they expect and I see no problem with that. Both seem to be insulated from the 'cancer' that is spreading in our world.

I might have an insulator of my own having found a way to market my hobby [rustic furniture]...remains to be seen if I can pull that one off.

I hope everyone, regardless of profession, gets back on solid ground very quickly!!

Chris Brault

01-09-2009, 11:57 PM

I've cooled it bigtime. I work for a big paper manafacturing company out here with only 6 paper machines remaining. There were 12 running at this site in the 80's. 3 years ago we had 1900 employees. Right now we are around 1000 and they are still cutting back and laying off. And we are extremely slower than normal.

So, I'm not planning any big purchases for awhile. I'm glad I have all the basics to work out there though. I've also been working real hard on my "Plan B" in case I lose my job. I come from a sawmill and logging background,, and know I must get a trade or some type of training if and when I need to find a new line of work.

John Sanford

01-10-2009, 2:44 AM

Welllll, for me, not lookin' good at all. I'm an IT guy who was laid off by a timeshare company (timeshare sales are WAYYYY down) in mid October. Have had a few nibbles, nothing concrete, so I have been gettign a fair amount of semi-productive shop time. Actually, I'm trying to use up a fair amount of the wood I've got laid in, because I surely don't want to have move it or put it in storage again! Tool purchases? haha!! My 18" bandsaw was literally 2 days away from being purchased. That check (my last) went for the rent, utilities, groceries, etc.

Unfortunately, the whole construction and trades picture here went from gangbusters to toilet. We're leading the nation in foreclosures, just behind Michigan in unemployment, etc.

I did get a 3/8" ID drill bushing today, does that count as a tool purchase? :o

Todd McGeachy

01-10-2009, 3:29 AM

Chris Brault : Hey Chris, I can see that happening. I run an Offset WebPress and this was the slowest Christmas in my career. Newspapers are an excellent barometer of the economy, as businesses slow down their spending on advertising tends to be more targeted. Check out your local one, it probably has way fewer flyers and is half the size of normal. If it isn't, check the ad count... if it is lower than 50% ads on a page they are in trouble and SHOULD be cutting back pages. Many I see now are 65% ads or even 70%, but many pages smaller. The weird thing is classifieds are dropping too, which you wouldn't expect.

The after Christmas season is usually slow, as many retailers blow their budget leading up to the week before Christmas, keep an eye on the papers as we go into mid-February and March when it should pick up.

Steve Rozmiarek

01-10-2009, 3:52 AM

Well, you all have me a bit bummed out! I'm a hobby guy, spent quite a bit on tools recently, and am not expecting to spend more (unless a great deal on an close edgebander, comes up). I'm growing my company, and having just reinvested a big part of my savings into it, again, I'm actually not worried too much.

We are in an industry that actually usually sees increased demand as times get tough, as long as exchange rates don't kill our export market. I can see the service businesses that support us hurting though, and it sucks to see guys you know and respect, having a hard go at it when they did nothing wrong.

I don't suppose I'm alone in going to the woodshop to decompress a bit. Times like these really do make you appreciate the little things, like having the luxury of spending a little more time in the shop, or with friends and family. Sometimes you need a reminder to pause and look hard at what you do have. When it gets better, we will be stronger for it.

Todd McGeachy

01-10-2009, 4:35 AM

Steve: Well at Kelly's request maybe these will cheer you up :)

Oh if they don't load on the first try just refresh your browser...

Here you go Kelly :)
The people of Nicaragua were unfailingly helpful and pleasant. I met some great people, rode in a taxi with no floor, was mistaken for a Canadian forces Colonel, shopped in a gold store with a armed escort and caught so many fish with the locals in 30 minutes my arms didn't work anymore and I had to stop. We also consumed liberal amounts of Flor de Caña (Look here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flor_de_Ca%C3%B1a ) My GOD its good stuff, laying on a hammock at the beach with a glass....ahhhhh
Anyway here is one of the workshops. It is amazing the quality of the work! Also notice the equipment through-out.
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/shop
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/shop2
Check out the block in the centre of the photo :)
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/shop3
Another quite nice block :)
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/block
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/Chair-shaping
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/sanding
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/Chair-prefinish
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/Chairs-prefinish
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/Chairs-prefinish2
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/progress
This is the table I want to be under in a earthquake :)
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/Table-1
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/Table-2
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/Table-3
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/Table-4
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/Table-5
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/Table-6
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/Table7
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/cabinet
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/Bed
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/Chair-2
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/Chair-3
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/Chair-side
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/clothes-valet
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/Rocker-1

And just for fun:
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/Granada

Right after I took this they stopped and picked-up 6 or so more people...oh and this was a mountain road :)
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/fullload
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/shoeshine

This is my friend Bob's house on the beach Pacific side; cool breeze all day.
$70, 000 gets you a custom house with handmade teak doors handmade tile, 2500 sq. ft. house,
with back-up power, well, guest-house and internet. Oh and a hunk of beach :)
I slept on the deck in a hammock at his other house :)
http://members.shaw.ca/ZephyrCombine/stellar/images/furniture/beachhouse

Keith Outten

01-10-2009, 8:02 AM

SawMill Creek is also suffering financially!

The economic situation seems to also be having an effect here at The Creek. Less than 30% of the people who donated last year at this point have donated.

We are losing our advertisers, Oneida just informed me that they will not be renewing their banner ad here after January 15th due to the economic downturn so we will be left with only one advertiser and Google. This puts us in a very delicate situation financially...right on the edge :(

It's strange in that we just had the best month in our six years online with nine and a half million pages viewed in December and 1.3 million hits per day. Our normal page view count is seven million page views per day so you can see we experienced a huge jump.

I didn't see this coming, in fact I was sure we were going to have our best year in 2009. In previous years we paid our bandwidth bill upfront for the entire year, this year it will be one month at a time :(

.

Bob Slater

01-10-2009, 8:31 AM

Well then this will prompt me to cough up my due. Was planning on buying stuff through your advertisers, and still probably will, but it is faster to just hit Paypal and deal with it later. Good to support a forum I get help and pleasure from. I sure hope we don't spiral into a depression. It seems to me some crazy types seem to be nostalgic for the 20's. Sorry to hear Oneida is pulling out. That is not a good sign. If they don't find this a useful vehicle, what is?

Charles Saunders

01-10-2009, 8:35 AM

Back in July of last year I became an unemployed IT guy as well, the result of a company acquisition, not so much due to the poor economy. But my job was in an industry already beat bloody by reduced consumer spending. Finding the next job has been hard.

On the micro level (i.e. my household) we’re doing OK but certainly are being careful with spending. My wife works in a recession-proof industry and has increased her hours for the short term. We are practicing “4-walls” accounting, essentially, and we know the life history of nearly every income dollar. To date we’ve avoided getting into any savings or investments. It helps that we have no debts but it still costs a lot to live. Woodworking has picked up mostly because I feel a need to stay busy. My shop is fairly complete for my needs and while I would like a dust control upgrade someday, I’m good for now. Of course I have to buy wood and consumables. I’ve been approached by neighbors who need various woodworking projects done and I’m considering one or two jobs to create some income and stay busy while I look for more regular employment.

On a macro level I see more woodworking machine tool listings on eBay and local Craigslist. As has been pointed out earlier, more of it appears to be 3-phase lately, which indicates to me that more businesses are downsizing or closing. Recent reports indicate German and Japanese machine tool orders have dropped 40-60%. Raw materials orders must be down as well. This is becoming a fairly big hole to climb out of, but as others have remarked it’s an opportunity to appreciate your friends and family and perhaps to do some different things. Any of you who have been adversely affected by the economic downturn have my best wishes.

Darrin Vanden Bosch

01-10-2009, 9:13 AM

I have been lucky to be working in a field that hasn't been hit as hard as some yet, even tho it is constuction.I've been building my shop building and contemplating buying more tooling, while I do have a decent amount of cash stashed away and investments (some that aren't what they use to be) I am thinking about doing with what I have with a few exeptions.
Especially after hearing the new jobless claims yesterday 540,000 new claims, 7% unemployment (those that are still collecting unemployment). The actual number of people out of work is approx. 13.2% ( heard this on the news also ). That is the number you don't hear on the news to often, but maybe you will in the near future.
As the economy resets itself maybe we will start producing something here again. The billions going to these failing corps. give the majority to small business' so the can start the rebound at a local level and let it trickle up for a change, because it doesn't seem to ever trickle down. Remember this country grew because of the mom and pop operations and other small business not because of walmart and the box stores.
Sorry, just a quick rant, had to get it out I guess.
Darrin

Tyler Boleyn

01-10-2009, 9:42 AM

I have canceled all large purchases for the time being except, glue, sandpaper, etc. Even if people get jobs, I don't look for much to change until consumer confidence rises.

Steve Griffin

01-10-2009, 9:45 AM

I don't suppose I'm alone in going to the woodshop to decompress a bit. Times like these really do make you appreciate the little things, like having the luxury of spending a little more time in the shop, or with friends and family. Sometimes you need a reminder to pause and look hard at what you do have. When it gets better, we will be stronger for it.

Absolutely. There are many good things in life which actually improve in down times. Scaling back and having less work for my business means less money, but also more family and hobby time.

Also, historically, the companies that can weather the down cycle really do well when things improve, since they are already in position to meet new demand.

So keep your heads up and don't forget to help out neighbors and family who are really in bad shape.

-Steve

Larry Edgerton

01-10-2009, 10:17 AM

SawMill Creek is also suffering financially!

It's strange in that we just had the best month in our six years online with nine and a half million pages viewed in December and 1.3 million hits per day. Our normal page view count is seven million page views per day so you can see we experienced a huge jump.

.

Keith, this may be because there there are a lot more guys like me that have time on their hands to goof around on the internet.

Two years ago I was never on the net, didn't have time.

Just curious, how much is a banner ad?

Gene Howe

01-10-2009, 10:26 AM

Going to have house upgraded to 200 amp service first.

Now, that's a good idea!

Dave Falkenstein

01-10-2009, 10:40 AM

Clifford Mescher

01-10-2009, 10:56 AM

I am retired and do woodworking projects for clients to earn tool money. Projects have slowed to a small trickle over the past year. During the summer I do deck projects, and typically have three to six per season. This past summer I had one. A full-time handyman friend is still busy, but mostly small projects - none of the week or two long remodels he used to get. Things for me are very slow, so my tool spending has stopped. We are being cautious about spending in general, although we try not to change our lifestyle drastically. At least some things we use every day are costing less, like gasoline and some groceries. We bought a HDTV a couple of months ago - that was our combined anniversary, birthday and Christmas gifts to each other. This is a good time to hang onto what you have.

Dave, I could have written your post. I am basically in the same situation. We also purchased a HDTV as a combination present to each other. Hanging on to what you have is good advice. We watch what we spend and enjoy the extra time together. I look at my wood stash and think of smaller things to make as I will not buy any wood in the near future. Thankfully I made some prudent decisions and there is just the two of us. Money is tight, but this is a major world-wide correction.Clifford

Steve Rozmiarek

01-10-2009, 2:46 PM

Steve: Well at Kelly's request maybe these will cheer you up :)

Wow! That must have been a fun trip! Thanks for posting those. It's interesting to see the similarities between their woodworking and ours. Pretty easy to see why American companies can't compete with the cost of import furniture.

Its also apparent that Nicaragua is the exact opposite of Nebraska...

Jason White

01-10-2009, 4:10 PM

My wife just got laid off, so there goes half of our income.

Sigh....

JW

Just wondering how the current economic "crisis" is affecting your woodworking.

Are you buying fewer tools and materials? If you're a pro, are you without customers/clients?

Just curious.

Speaking for myself, all future power tool acquisitions are on standby.

JW

Burt Waddell

01-10-2009, 6:58 PM

Woodworking business in the south is hurting. For 2008 I did about 30% of what we normally do. I had to lay-off my helper.

Burt

Karl Brogger

01-10-2009, 9:34 PM

Woodworking business in the south is hurting. For 2008 I did about 30% of what we normally do. I had to lay-off my helper.

Burt

Thats almost exactly where I'm at. In 2007, which was my 4th year on my own, I did about $125k worth of business, and not working that hard to do so. Which really isn't that much, but comparing it to the previous three years it was pretty nice. More than the previous years combined actually. 2008 on the other hand, I did less than $40k, and had to lay off my one employee in August. That hurts, alot. I had big plans of building a new shop this year, with hopes that with the tooling that I had added in 2006 and 2007, and bringing in another employee would support doubling production for 2008. Not meant to be apparently.

The truth is that with faith in the economy being so low, there just isn't anything going on. It really is something that had to happen. The result button had to be hit. Someone mentioned weathering the storm, that's exactly what those in the biz need to do. I'm glad that I didn't build a shop. If I had I would be in a world of trouble right now. As of right now my company has zero debt, and that is the only reason I have made it as far as I have. I know of some local shops that are in serious debt, and serious trouble. Thats what will kill you, if you hit serious slow times like now, staying ahead is hard, if not impossible.

When I started, I had a certain demographic that I wanted to persue. Painting the cabinetry market with a brood brush I view it as having about 5 different types of clientel.

-5 The Ultra rich, they don't build houses, they buy palaces. Very small market. For all intensive purposes non-existent, and like the prom queen, impenitrable.
-4 The wealthy, they make large sums of money. Generally the type who wouldn't buy a house in a development. Also a small market, really tough to get into unless you know someone who builds these houses.
-3 Those with a decent income, at minimum $100k per year. Wouldn't buy or build a $5million home, but would build/buy a $1m home, but not as a status symbol. Meaning they don't need 10,000 sq/ft just to prove to their friends that they've made it. (There's plenty of wanna-be's for this class. They're the ones who when I had to do a service call had an Escalade, a BMW sitting in the driveway, and a big screan tv sitting on the floor, but no furniture, and nothing hanging on the walls.) This is a pretty good sized market. They're smart, have money, and for the most part know what they want.
-2 basically the middle class. They work crappy jobs, own a minivan and usually have to borrow and a narrow budget determines what they can do. Its a huge market, but they are about as likely to go to a box store and get box cabinets than anything.
-1 Trailer parks and apartments don't need custom cabinets.

Dave Potter

01-10-2009, 10:12 PM

The "economy" went sour on my wife and I about two years ago when the mismanaging SOB at the plant where my wife had worked for 16 years decided the best way to shore up on the losses the plant was having was to fire anyone who made more than $15.00 an hour. After that, despite her years of experience at supervising a production team, the only other work my wife could find was as a temp manufacturing worker. Over the past two-years her income steadily eroded to the point she's now making about half what it was before this.

Now, throw in the surge in fuel prices over the last year coupled my own work-place going all stingy with me about a raise and telling me I should be delighted with even having a job, and we've been hit pretty hard. I guess my deciding to finally starting to do woodworking seriously (something I wanted to do for such a long, long time) at about the same time as her job loss ill-timed, but I'm doing it on a shoe-string and I'm rather pleased so far.

I haunt CL and Freecycle looking for free or low cost lumber (mostly used and abused) and equipment, and took a part-time job in a hardware store to afford a few little extras now and then. I've set up a room in the basement, upgraded the electrical and lighting for the room, built benches and storage there. I'm looking to convert half our garage into my finish room and I'm working out the material and plans for that now. I've also been working out a shop-made dust collection system I'm confident will work (fingers-crossed) and casting a slop-sink out of concrete to make clean ups easier.

Maybe I won't be buying any exotic woods or top-of-the-line tools any time soon, but I'm looking out for the best I can get my hands on a piece at a time as far as equipment goes and am being as frugal as possible with materials. It's a stretch, but I'm sure I'll get it done.

Of course, I'm still buying a couple of lottery tickets each week and dreaming of the highest end shop I can image. Maybe a little luck will come my way.http://www.sawmillcreek.org/images/icons/icon12.gif

Dave Potter