Pocket screws for this small table?

[Matt Day]

I was wondering if pocket screws would work okay with this small table for most (all?) of the joinery? Should I also use glue?

I'll probably use figure 8's or clips to attach the top, and a glue joint bit for the drawer.

This is the One-Drawer Lamp Stand from FWW, and I plan to make two.

Thanks

[Jamie Buxton]

You could use pocket screws, but it seems a shame. That table is a nice traditional design, with traditional joinery. Scrapping the joinery in favor of pocket screws doesn't seem right to me.

If you do use pocket screws, glue probably won't help in most of the joints. For instance, where you're joining the rails to the legs, the glue joint will involve end-grain on the end of the rails. Glue doesn't bond end-grain particularly well. Furthermore, you're likely to get squeeze-out in a concave spot, where it is difficult to clean off.

I like your plan of figure-8 or clips for the top. The fastening scheme shown in the drawing doesn't allow for wood movement.

[Greg Cole]

You could use pocket screws, but it seems a shame. That table is a nice traditional design, with traditional joinery. Scrapping the joinery in favor of pocket screws doesn't seem right to me.

+1 To that sentiment.
Granted time is always an issue and you'll get a bunch of responses in favor of the pocket screws, I am sure.
I'd take the extra but of time and do loose tenons, traditional M & T or mini sliding DT to connect the aprons to the legs.
Just my less than humble $0.02. :p

[Steve Schoene]

If you use pocket screws to attach legs to rails and the like, you will have a reasonably solid table to begin with, but don't count on it having a long life as wood moves and screws inevitably loosen. You would be thinking about it being a 15-20 year table, like kitchen cabinetry. With well cut M&T joints, glued with hide glue, you could be talking about a 200 year table.

[Matt Day]

I agree with you both. This is going to be a belated wedding gift to some friends. I can do the traditional joinery but it would take me a lot longer and i've got a lot other projects in the queue.

Whichever way I do it the table will look the same from the outside, but I guess I have to decide if they'll appreciate the jointery or not. They do seem to like Ikea for instance.

Maybe I'll do a combination of traditional (using power tools though) joints and some quicker means here and there. We'll see.

[Prashun Patel]

My gosh, 15-20 years for a table seems pretty good.

Pocket screws will make assembly go very quickly. I'd use a small amount of glue on each joint also for minor reinforcement. If yr screws loosen over time, it's simple to add reinforcements. I believe your taste will change before the joint deteriorates.

In fact, you can even use pocketscrews to attach the tabletop. After you drill the pocket, enlarge the hole slightly and your pocket screw will allow for minor wood movement. No chiseling for the fig-8's required.

Another option to M&T is dowels. If you have a good jig (like Dowelmax) it can be about as easy as pocket screws. I prefer dowels when a) both sides of the joint are exposed or b) The joint is offset (with pocketscrews, aligment can get a little squirelly.)

[Joe Scharle]

Pocket hole joinery has been used in furniture manufacturing for at least 100 years and samples I've repaired used plain FH screws. The new screws (Kreg style) will probably last even longer. I've built many pieces with PH screws and glue and a few without glue.

[Greg Hines, MD]

The pocket holes for attaching the top should do well for you. I don't know that you need the figure 8s. I would suggest just using one in the center of the panel on the sides of it, instead of the pictured two, to allow the top to expand and contract, but it should work fine.

I would not build the table with screws, however. Someone said it just does not seem right, and I would agree.

Doc

[Steve Schoene]

I sure wouldn't call 20 years for a piece of hardwood furniture to be pretty good.
It's kind of like saying I expect the marriage to last 15-20 years. I'd might not expect that life from all of the IKEA stuff, but pretty close.

Sure their are uses for pocket screws in furniture. Attaching tops is one good example. But attaching the aprons and legs together wouldn't be anything I would be happy with.

[frank shic]

matt, if you're rushed for time pocket screws will definitely work for attaching the aprons to the legs and you if you plan on using a false front on the drawer you can even pocket screw the drawer parts together and forego using a drawer lock miter bit. i would recommend gluing the top together as the pocket screws don't do such a great job with the wood expansion/contraction. you can use the table mounting clips from rockler's to mount the top to the table. you may run into problems if you just pocket the table top to the aprons once again because of expansion/contraction. on the other hand if you have more time, it would be a great project for learning how to cut mortise and tenon and dovetail joints wiht either hand tools methods or power tools!

[John Schreiber]

I think it's a question of the kind of gift you want to give. Mortise and tenon and dovetails will last effectively forever. The design is classic and simple and will always go with something.

But, if you skip the drawer and use pocket screws, you could put a pair of them together in an afternoon and it will probably last for many years.

Both are totally legitimate. I made a pocket screwed night stand for my daughter for Christmas. It's not fine furniture, but it's better than what I would have bought for her at a store and it cost me less.

[Jim Becker]

Absolutely they will work. Thats how I'm building most of my small tables these days. I have zero fear about them "not lasting". I would not hesitate to do M&T for larger surfaces that are expected to hold a lot of weight or for something that will get a lot of rough use, but for end tables, hall tables, sofa tables, etc...I'm very comfortable with the pocket screw construction. The combination of glue and the screws makes for a respectable joint.