Raised Panels - Sizing Question

[Brent Ring]

All,

I am working on my first batch of raised panels and would like to know how much you undersize the panel. I know that the spaceballs are included to keep the panels from rattling. So if my rails are 10", do I make the panels 9-7/8"?

Thanks

Brent

[Paul Ryan]

I usually give my self 3/16 to 1/4 inch total, so about 1/8 on all sides. But I dont use the balls.

[Lee Schierer]

I do about the same, but am thinking about usng the balls. I tried to buy some the last time I was in a Rockler store but they were out of them.

[frank shic]

brent, if you size the panels by subtracting a 1/4" (1/8" x 2) you will have enough space for the space balls.

[Kevin Godshall]

A tip was on a woodworking show I saw somewhere, where they took a took of silicone and cut the opening to 1/4", and make lines with it. After it dried, they cut them (as needed) into 1/4" lengths, and presto, homemade spaceballs.

[Joe Chritz]

I have used silicone, foam and now just buy spaceballs. They are so much easier and handy. I keep several hundred in an old empty biscuit container. I get the soft .26 size and they stay right in a 1/4 slot.

I use a cabinet door program but I set the program to give me 3/16 in the winter and 1/4 in the summer if I remember to change it. I figure about half compression is about right with the spaceballs.

Joe

[Josiah Bartlett]

You don't need as much space where the grain of the panel and the frame are perpendicular to each other if the wood is the same species. If the grain of the panel is vertical, this would mean that the top and bottom don't need much gap but the sides do. I like to leave a minimal gap at the top and bottom of doors (assuming the grain is vertical). This keeps the panel from being off-center in the frame after a while. If the door is really wide I would allow yourself more space that the amount given above. Its really more of a % movement of the total width (the width being perpendicular to the grain) than a total number.

[Jim Dunn]

I built a door using space balls and found that they were great for centering the panel in the stile and rails. Couldn't have been simpler.:eek:

[Charlie Plesums]

The space balls folks recommend that you allow 5/32' for .026" (1/4 inch) space balls, or slightly less than 50% compression. With balls on both sides, that means you panel is 5/16 narrower than the space for it.

I have a free spreadsheet for helping with those calculations on the "doors" page of my solo woodworking web site. Check my profile for the link. Drop me an email or PM if you have any questions on it.

[Bill Huber]

Not to hijack the thread but I do have a question......

I just want to make sure I am right.

If I use plywood for a panel door I don't have to worry about it and I can glue them if I want, is this correct?

[Jim Dunn]

Bill, wouldn't you still have to worry about stiles and rail movement. I don't think I'd glue the panel in the door. Somebody with more experience help us here.

[Larry Edgerton]

Not to hijack the thread but I do have a question......

I just want to make sure I am right.

If I use plywood for a panel door I don't have to worry about it and I can glue them if I want, is this correct?

Bill

Any time you have different materials or grain direction changes there will be movement, even with plywood. Dont glue it.

I use spaceballs myself, and before that I centered the panels and pinned then in the center of the rail on the back side. I started making "space balls" like someone mentioned above with the silicone, but the balls are a no brainer.

How many of you have knocked over the jar of spaceballs? :)

[Rob Cunningham]

How many of you have knocked over the jar of spaceballs? :)

It's amazing how far they can roll!

Bill,
If I'm using a plywood panel, I make it 1/32" undersized, and do not glue it.

[Brian Peters]

Not to hijack the thread but I do have a question......

I just want to make sure I am right.

If I use plywood for a panel door I don't have to worry about it and I can glue them if I want, is this correct?

That's a heated topic, a lot of publications have advised people to glue panels in; not with plywood. While plywood is stable, and much more so than solid wood, it's still wood just the same. I try not to even do it with MDF if i can. Either pin nails or space balls.

[J.R. Rutter]

My only comment on Space Balls is that if you overcompress them, they bleed an oily plasticizer that can soak through lighter woods like cherry. That 5/32" on all sides recommendation sounds good to me, except that I allow less space top and bottom to help keep the rails from pushing in too far while gluing. This may not be an issue depending on how you clamp.

[Steve Clardy]

Spaceballs, yes I use the recommended 5/32" on the sides of the panels for clearance.
Top and bottom I just clearance a 1/16" or so and use no spaceballs.


Ply panels, I use nothing, just undersize them a 1/32" or so, and pin them on the back with a 23ga. pinner. No glue. I do not want a glue mess on a panel showing up when it's finishing time.

[Larry Edgerton]

That's a heated topic, a lot of publications have advised people to glue panels in; not with plywood. .

Which just goes to show you that you should never believe all you read. :)

Its not a heated topic, you would have to be an idiot to ignore the basic premise of the raised panel and glue it.

I once bought a Vega GT when it was named "Car of the Year" by one of the auto rags. I have not trusted anything that I read in a magazine as absolute truth since.........