Wisdom of the ancients, true or false

[Mike Henderson]

I don't worry about it.

Me neither!

Mike

[James Pallas]

Fore plane, jack plane I lift and let the toe ride the work. Jointer, smoother I lift all off the work. I've found that if you let the toe ride with a jointer or smoother you will need to plane more to remove small crushed areas. I would stress that this is in most cases. The wood you are working can make a big difference, such as letting the toe ride on red cedar. That can be a "crushing" experience.
Jim

[michael langman]

Now I can answer the question of how much metal is removed by dragging something back instead of lifting it.

I bought a grinding vise in 1991 that was made out of O1 tool steel hardened to 59-60 Rc.
I used that vise for 13 years every day grinding tooling on a surface grinder with a 6" x 18" browne and sharpe grinding chuck. The chuck did not demagnetize the grinding vise. It used a mechanical lever to turn the magnetism on and off on the chuck.
After the chuck was turned off, I would grab the grinding vise with two hands on the top of the vise, and slide the vise towards me, picking it up at the same time.
I was told by another toolmaker that I was going to wear the bottom surface of my grinding vise out of flatness removing it that way. And also wear the surface of the grinding chuck. I was suppose to grab the grinding vise and tilt it onto it's long edge and lift it off the chuck. The grinding vise and the part in it being ground weighs between 8-15 pounds depending on the size of the part being ground. I chose to slide it off the chuck, and regrind my vise, and the grinders chuck as needed.

It took 13 years to wear the bottom surface of my grinding vise .0002 of an inch along the front edge of the grinding vise underneath the solid jaw of the vise, going back about 1/4" from the edge. Lifting the vise off of the magnetic chuck the worn surface would swipe the edge of the chuck on the grinder.

[Jim Koepke]

It took 13 years to wear the bottom surface of my grinding vise .0002 of an inch along the front edge of the grinding vise underneath the solid jaw of the vise, going back about 1/4" from the edge.

How many times a day did you do this operation?

How many passes a day would someone do a similar operation with a plane?

jtk

[Pat Barry]

Now I can answer the question of how much metal is removed by dragging something back instead of lifting it.

I bought a grinding vise in 1991 that was made out of O1 tool steel hardened to 59-60 Rc.
I used that vise for 13 years every day grinding tooling on a surface grinder with a 6" x 18" browne and sharpe grinding chuck. The chuck did not demagnetize the grinding vise. It used a mechanical lever to turn the magnetism on and off on the chuck.
After the chuck was turned off, I would grab the grinding vise with two hands on the top of the vise, and slide the vise towards me, picking it up at the same time.
I was told by another toolmaker that I was going to wear the bottom surface of my grinding vise out of flatness removing it that way. And also wear the surface of the grinding chuck. I was suppose to grab the grinding vise and tilt it onto it's long edge and lift it off the chuck. The grinding vise and the part in it being ground weighs between 8-15 pounds depending on the size of the part being ground. I chose to slide it off the chuck, and regrind my vise, and the grinders chuck as needed.

It took 13 years to wear the bottom surface of my grinding vise .0002 of an inch along the front edge of the grinding vise underneath the solid jaw of the vise, going back about 1/4" from the edge. Lifting the vise off of the magnetic chuck the worn surface would swipe the edge of the chuck on the grinder.

Let's assume the vise weighed 15 lbs. I bet the surface area of the base was at least 5 sq in ( probably much more ). The pressure involved was about 3 psi or less. Now take a plane blade 2 in wide with .010 inches of contact with the wood. That's .02 sq inches or less. Let's say the plane weighs 5 lbs. Thats 250 psi minimum. I'd say the wear on the plane blade is significantly higher. Now factor in the distance dragged and the frequency of occurrence and that little plane blade takes a beating by comparison.

[Stanley Covington]

Believe it or not there is a pretty good group of people who are afraid to strop a plane iron on leather, for fear of "dubbing", then procede to raise the iron up 15 degrees or more and rub it backwards with pressure on the wood as they plane.
For my own planes I strop with clean leather and lift the plane on the back stroke.

Sound logic. Excellent technique.

[michael langman]

Jim, I was just trying to give an idea of the amount of wear put onto a piece of steel being rubbed across a surface. The metal of the plane is not even hardened, so two operations are not the same. Just similar.

[Jerry Olexa]

I echo Mike and Lowell....Don't worry about it....