Stabilizing a started project

[Justin Pawlowski]

So I turned a couple of practice bowls from a bad part of an elm slab. One of the bowls has a lot of character in it but the wood is too punky to sand. Even though this project is probably past the point of saving can you stabilize a started project once you realize it has a lot of character? If so what is the point of no return?

[Jay Mullins]

Justin,
When turning punky wood that crumbles, and not wanting to toss the wood into the burn pile,some options are;
1.stabilize the wood by applying as much CA, shellac, lacquer or other fast drying chemical as the wood will absorb. Let it dry and continue turning or sanding.

2. I have found that when sanding punky wood ( after soaking with shellac and letting it dry) I use a high speed sander with the lathe turning slow works for me. It creates a lot of dust so wear a respirator and have adequate ventilation. Apply additional shellac or sealer as needed and let it dry before turning or sanding.

3. Sometimes the only solution is to toss it and start over.

Good luck

Jay Mullins

[John K Jordan]

I usually do what Jay does. I try shellac-based sanding sealer first and if that is insufficient I go to CA glue. I might have to make multiple applications and let dry/harden each time. (The minwax wood hardener seems worthless.)

Note that the wood may suck up a LOT of CA, maybe a bottle or two depending on the size of the piece. The wood has to be very special to go to this much effort rather than just toss the wood!

An example: a friend sent me a small piece of wood that was so punky in places that pieces would crumble when touched with a fingernail. I used a lot of CA glue, kept applying and letting it harden, turn a little, apply more CA, repeat. Finally the wood was mostly wood-colored CA in places! The wood was special to me so it was worth it - this is the result:

LiquidAmber_comp.jpg

You can also buy into some stabilization process that uses resin with vacuum but that's expensive, especially with larger pieces.

JKJ

[Damon McLaughlin]

I too use sanding sealer, at times lots of it. I set the wood aside for a few days sometimes after applying sanding sealer as it helps it to dry thoroughly, then I do some finish cuts with a freshly sharpened tool. I supposed you could try to soak the wood with a stabilizing resin and then bake it but you'll have to re-turn both the outside and inside. I recently started using Deft spray lacquer sanding sealer and find that it works very well and dries quickly.

[richard shelby]

I've turned a lot of "punky" oak lately. Here's my trick. Mix a batch of epoxy. Before it "kicks" dilute in acetone about 50:50. Brush liberally on the punk and allow to dry. The acetone will volitalize leaving the epoxy behind. It may not stain like the rest of the wood, but this is not a uniform piece to start with, is it?

[Harold Balzonia]

This salad bowl was so punky it was like turning popcorn... I used thinned epoxy to harden up most of it and while finish turning I had to add CA on occasion. I could have used CA on the whole thing, but it would have soaked up 8-10 of the big bottles.

IMG_2343.jpg

I used ca and epoxy on this mass, as well. EVERYTHING is savable if you have the desire.

IMG_2498.jpg

BTW - When adding CA to very punky/spalted wood, the CA can often smoke like a tear gas canister shot into a drug lord's living room.... it is a violent chemical reaction. Stay near fresh air!

[Justin Pawlowski]

Thanks everyone for your great advise. I am in the process of getting a vacuum camber system but will try the thinned epoxy for now. In order to save on stabilizing resin for a vacuum system is it more economical to rough turn a bowl, then stabilize/bake it, then finish turn it? Seems you would go through a lot of resin unnecessarily if you stabilized the whole bowl blank.

[Perry Hilbert Jr]

the only time I ever tried to save a piece of decaying wood, was with some thing called wood petrifier. It was about like DNA in viscosity and soaked into the wood a bit. When it hardened, the surface was hard like plasticized wood, but inside, it was still punky. I don't think it would soak in enough to save a bowl.

[Robert Willing]

Try some of this https://www.homedepot.com/p/Minwax-1...0000/100376253 I use this.

[robert baccus]

Try mixing epoxy or polyester resin and diluting it with acetone as above. Throw your bowl and mix into a black vinyl--repeat vinyl bag. It will stay liquid for hours--play shake and bake several times and wait overnite. It will not change the wood character or color--the soft stuff only will absorb the resin mix. Done it many times on very soft punky wood. Cheap and fast.

[Harold Balzonia]

Thanks everyone for your great advise. I am in the process of getting a vacuum camber system but will try the thinned epoxy for now. In order to save on stabilizing resin for a vacuum system is it more economical to rough turn a bowl, then stabilize/bake it, then finish turn it? Seems you would go through a lot of resin unnecessarily if you stabilized the whole bowl blank.

yes. - rough turn the blank into your bowl form before stabilizing with cactus juice or whatever brand stabilizing resin you choose.

FWIW - I have found that that I don't really need to vacuum bowl blanks. If you rough turn it close enough to final thickness, the resin only has to penetrate a 1/4" or so. Easy for that to happen in punk wood. Plus, my vacuum chamber isn't big enough to handle the size of bowl I usually turn. I submerge the blank in the resin for a couple of days, at least. The remaining resin that isn't absorbed can be reused so don't throw it out.

baking a bowl blank takes a lot longer than a batch of pen blanks. I've had to bake bowls for 6 hours or more. Don't be in a hurry!

[Olaf Vogel]

Try some of this https://www.homedepot.com/p/Minwax-1...0000/100376253 I use this.

I was a big fan of this. But its tough to find (in Canada at least) an expensive. Plus a punky piece soaks up a lot of Minwax.

So I switched to epoxy as well. But to reduce smell, I thin it with rubbing alcohol instead of acetone.
It still soaks in well, but its a lot thicker than the Minwax - and cheaper.

And yes, punky pieces are often well worth saving. You can get some awesome grain patterns

[John K Jordan]

Try some of this https://www.homedepot.com/p/Minwax-1...0000/100376253 I use this.

I tried that on a bowl with punky areas. I used a whole can. Then I used most of a second can. It still didn't stabilize the soft areas enough so I used CA glue. Next time I'll try the epoxy, if there is a next time. The older I get the less I enjoy turning punky wood.

[robert baccus]

No doubt the vacum chanbers and resins work very well for small objects. Don't confuse the process with soaking with thinned resins however. The vacum thing results in solid plastic in the wood cells and in voids also. The thinned resins results in the cell walls being stiffened but the cells themselves remaining open resulting in wood that perfectly resembling solid virgin wood. One ends up being solid plastic with a pattern of wood and the other being like wood in feel and finishing. A difference in the finished product to remember. Also in the "bag thing" you lose no resin mixture--it all soaks into the soft wood--not the hard solid wood.