Reclaimed industrial flooring

[Brian Akers]

What would you guys pay for some reclaimed industrial heart pine flooring per bdft? 32 boards ~7"W x 2"thick x 11' long----- ~415 bdft.

Already de-nailed but still has paint on the tops. Most has nice tight grain, probably 3/4 of it anyways.
It's the front stack in the photo

Thanks!

MVIMG_20171118_171108_exported_9013266455881909150-2016x1512.jpg

[Tom M King]

I use Heart Pine a lot in my work. Value would be nothing to $27 a board foot, but the high end stuff needs to either be longer than that (like 20 feet), or really fine grained quarter-sawn, with no knots, and no nail holes. I would need better pictures, up close, and end grain, to be able to say.

What year was the building it came out of it built?

[Brian Akers]

All I know is it was from a factory from the 20s. He has a lot of 16 footers but the grain isn't nearly as tight on those. These were the straightest and tighter grained boards. Essentially he's asking a little less than $2.50 a bdft. I'll take some end grain pics a little later.

[Mel Fulks]

There is big dealer is this city ,that mostly sells by cut list. Crazy expensive. I think you are fine, if you if you actually use it. Somehow the stuff seems to get confused with gold bullion.

[Brian Akers]

Yeah I have several tables tops I need to do and I think this will be great for them.

[Jim Mackell]

Your call, but I'd take it and run away with a big smile on my face!

[Morey St. Denis]

Are your own expectations for its rarity and value relatively moderate? Most of the Old Growth long leaf yellow "heart" pine was very seriously depleted by the close of the 19th century. The really superb lumber that exhibits 20-30 annular rings per radial inch and nearly as dense as oak, is quite a rarity these days. Assuming this was all flatsawn, showing largely rift-cut end grain?.. Is it a full 8/4" in thickness by 7.0" width or the conventional 6.5" width? It does look to be at least 8/4" with about a 5/8" - 3/4" spline groove? Our conventional dimensional specs for kiln dried milled lumber were effected about 1906 and very quickly adopted for industrial & residential building construction use. Noticing that this appears all continuous spline jointed both edges, brings to mind that much of that configuration also got employed as roof decking; any evidence of roofing nails having penetrated the unpainted side? If potentially roof decking, be especially aware of making the effort to check it carefully for flatness along the full length. A hundred years of seasoning in flat spans over wide spaced rafters can impose a considerably "bowed" set and may interfere with your expectations for eventual yield after jointing and resawing. Without further detail as to its particular qualities, value would not likely exceed about $4 per bdft.

It is currently in the 'Salvaged' state, but not yet qualifying as "reclaimed" suitable for repurposing, until all that existing leaded paint is safely & carefully removed. If you decide to get it, do be sure to also factor in your investment in a quality metal detector, a portable paint shaver (suggest the Metbo LF-724S, a Bosch 1595, or equivalent), disposable Tyek HAZMAT suits, breathing mask filters rated to around 0.5 micron, good disposable vacuum filtration exhausting outdoors, etc; unless you already happen to own all this equipment. Not intending to dampen anyone's enthusiasm; you'll truly enjoy the well seasoned stability and rich color awarded after nearly a century of aging. Set aside a portion to be jointed, ripsaw halved, and laminated on edge, I see luxury new workbench build written all over this!

[Mel Fulks]

I've seen thinner flooring (maybe 1and 1/4) used . Way too much work for the yield. The thickness of what you are buying makes such a difference.

[Brian Akers]

So its probably about 5.75" of "meat". Just over 2" thick. I have access to the large shop where I work part time. The owner gave us a chance to buy some of it. He bought the whole lot of flooring before they tore the factory down. He said the last time the we're resurfaced was in the 20s. We have good dust collection there and I have a quality mask. A lot of it is flatsawn buy some is rift. Either way I'm gonna get it.
MVIMG_20171119_134601-2016x1512-1.jpg

[Morey St. Denis]

Looks promising Brian. I'll share with you several images from my recent collection of old growth SYP (Pinus Palustris) amounting to over 6K bf. These were salvaged from a recent demolition of the first US Michelin tire plant and a condo renovation at the historic National Musical String Company; the former well seasoned after 110 years and the later almost 5 quarter centuries. They were joists & rafters at 8/4" x 12", splined decking at 10/4" x 8", beams and rafter truss sections up to 10" x 8". All were hard won over the past year at no real cost, (other than a broken finger) and considerable physical effort without use of power assisted equipment; only a compact back pack of hand tools with occasional use of a come-along strap winch required to extricate some larger beams. Most had to be manually carried about three hundred yards to a convenient extraction point in a variety of frequently changing, sometimes adverse, weather conditions."Nunc est Bibendum"!.. One image also shows a typical contemporary "2x4" of a similar species for comparison.

[Tom M King]

Morey, how long are the rafter sections, and are any of them for sale?

[Morey St. Denis]

Tom, these are not lightweight pine, as you well know. Those 8" x 8" & 8" x 10" beams had to be hand sawn on site to a modest length where I could manually lift one end upright, topple the section end for end to move it out of the wreckage, then harness to my waist and drag each length about an eighth mile over masonry and rubble. The longest are in the range of 36 bdft each piece, at a length around 5 1/2 ft, some shorter. I had no commercial intent in recovering these; a portion will go to a historical foundation of which I am a volunteer member, for use in rebuilding and furnishing a working 18th century historical plantation in an area not far from Gettysburg. There is a restored log barn, large stone tavern dating to the late 17th century, wheelwright's workshop (where traditional woodworking with period hand tools is practiced), a blacksmith's forge, smoke house, outdoor wood fired brick oven, working distillery, fruit orchard and crop gardens. The property owner of the former Michelin plant, erected largely 1907 to 1919, would have preferred that I might commit to salvaging several hundred thousand board feet of timber from these buildings over a roughly 22 acre property, but I had not the time, manpower, heavy equipment, nor storage facilities for such a massive quantity. It was a real shame to have the vast majority of this antique heart pine busted up and trucked nearly 450 miles to a landfill in Minerva, Ohio where they apparently had the best rates on accepting demolition materials with mild toxic content such as asbestos roofing, mastic, lead painted wood & masonry. Being this is a highly urbanized area now, there was no interest in reclaiming useful and historic materials. I initially met with town authorities, owner & property manager, an EPA environmental site monitor and the demolition contractor; all but the deconstruction contractor thought it seemed a fine idea, but no one came forward with enough commercial interest to actually commit to doing the work in any timely manner. Had this been located in a still rural area, I've little doubt there would have been plenty of interest and competition to gain access to the valuable timber. There was only ever the mildest effort to effectively recover for recycling, copper wire & flashing, iron pipe, structural steel and some aluminum.

Believe you are too far away to make any transfer feasible, tell me about the use you might have for such material and I'll keep you in mind. I may have occasion to visit a cousin located in Asheville come late spring.

[Tom M King]

Very good work! I need some 10 footers, to replace some floor joists in a house whose date is yet to be determined by Dendro, but probably 1755. I have other sources, but was just wondering where you were, and if you wanted to sell any. Even Asheville is a long way from me. Check out my website. I think if you click on my name, you may find it in my profile somewhere. I don't spend much time on these forums, and am not allowed to post a link to my website, since it's commercial...sort of. I'm years behind in updating the site-just too busy, but it will give you an idea of what I do.

[Mel Fulks]

I've heard that the wood salvage dealers go all over to bid on that stuff. Much of it is in urban areas and the winner has to get rid of everything. So they have to figure in what all the materials will bring in or cost to get rid of.

[Morey St. Denis]

Bid?.. You must be thinking of reclaimed lumber and barn wood brokers. When a retired old industrial building needs to come down any painted timber suddenly becomes viewed as toxic waste. Most property owners in urban locations are only too happy to have you take it off their hands, saves them plenty on disposal, hauling and landfill costs. Problem is the people who can handle and reclaim this stuff are located largely in distant rural areas and are accustomed to deconstructing barns and agricultural installations. They can't have you compromising structural integrity where a hazard is created for later demolition workers. When EPA monitoring becomes involved, ground troops are needed daily to spray down the worksite for dust control as the excavation equipment does its work. You also must commit to typically rather tight time schedules, in my experience.