Firmer Chisels

[ken hatch]

Modern makers of firmer chisels are almost extinct. While they can be found used on eBay it's such a crap shoot I'd like to find a modern maker.

Cut to the chase, while googling firmer chisels today one of the hits was Amazon for Narex firmer chisels and I followed the link. Sure nuff the link lead to Narex firmer chisels. They looked like firmer chisels, the handle didn't look as 'clunky' as other Narex chisels and a set of four: 6mm, 12mm, 20mm, and 26mm were less than $50 USD delivered to my door today. I paid almost that much for a 1/2" Weatherby firmer off eBay the other day. First impression is good, the chisels have nice balance, the backs, of at least the 26mm, are very slightly concave. Less than 3 minutes on the 400 Atomic and it was flat. The bevel and back honed up quickly on the med India and Hard Black Ark developing a nice burr quickly and got a beautiful 'polish' on one of the hard JNAT's. I'm not one for 'testing" sharpness...If it feels sharp and looks sharp it is sharp but I have a new bald spot on my left arm.

They may be keepers,

ken

[bridger berdel]

Let us know how you like 'em in the cut.....

[ken hatch]

Let us know how you like 'em in the cut.....

Bridger,

Will do. Prepped the 26mm last night, The back was very slightly concave so it went quickly, well less than 3-4 minutes on a 400 Atomia followed by a med India and a Hard Black Ark. It felt a little "sticky" on the stone, I'm not sure if it is the steel or the protective coating. I expect the protective coating. I skipped the 400 Atomia on the bevel but added a hard JNAT to polish and pulled the burr on a strop. It looks and feels very sharp.

ken

[Patrick Chase]

Modern makers of firmer chisels are almost extinct. While they can be found used on eBay it's such a crap shoot I'd like to find a modern maker.

Cut to the chase, while googling firmer chisels today one of the hits was Amazon for Narex firmer chisels and I followed the link. Sure nuff the link lead to Narex firmer chisels. They looked like firmer chisels, the handle didn't look as 'clunky' as other Narex chisels and a set of four: 6mm, 12mm, 20mm, and 26mm were less than $50 USD delivered to my door today.

How are they for flatness?

One reason Narex chisels are inexpensive is because they aren't post-machined after hardening. Narex uses a single-cycle hardening/tempering process (Austempering) that produces relatively low distortion, but even so their chisels aren't as flat as some others that are post-machined. My set of Narex paring chisels were particularly unpleasant to set up, though they work terrifically now.

[ken hatch]

How are they for flatness?

One reason Narex chisels are inexpensive is because they aren't post-machined after hardening. Narex uses a single-cycle hardening/tempering process (Austempering) that produces relatively low distortion, but even so their chisels aren't as flat as some others that are post-machined. My set of Narex paring chisels were particularly unpleasant to set up, though they work terrifically now.

Patrick,

The one I worked on last night was slightly concave, flatting went very quickly.

ken

[Pat Barry]

I looked at the Narex 'firmer' chisels - they look nice, but don't see a lot of difference as compared to their bench chisels except for the handle. What characteristics make a chisel a 'firmer' chisel? What is the purpose of a 'firmer' chisel as compared to say, a bench chisel.

[ken hatch]

I looked at the Narex 'firmer' chisels - they look nice, but don't see a lot of difference as compared to their bench chisels except for the handle. What characteristics make a chisel a 'firmer' chisel? What is the purpose of a 'firmer' chisel as compared to say, a bench chisel.

Pat,

No side bevel, a flat side on the blade. There are several uses for firmer type chisels. With a thick heavy blade they are used for timber framing. The ones I'm interested in have a longer thin blade and are good for paring. The Narex blades are shorter than I would like but at their price point are worth a try.

The difference in the handle vs. the Narex bench chisel's was one of the reasons I ordered a set. While I'm sure I'm being unfair I can't get pass the bench chisel's handle.

ken

[Pat Barry]

Pat,

No side bevel, a flat side on the blade. There are several uses for firmer type chisels. With a thick heavy blade they are used for timber framing. The ones I'm interested in have a longer thin blade and are good for paring. The Narex blades are shorter than I would like but at their price point are worth a try.

The difference in the handle vs. the Narex bench chisel's was one of the reasons I ordered a set. While I'm sure I'm being unfair I can't get pass the bench chisel's handle.

ken

Thanks for clarifying Ken. Those would probably work better than the bevel edge chisel for chopping mortices ala Paul Sellars method also.

[Patrick Chase]

The difference in the handle vs. the Narex bench chisel's was one of the reasons I ordered a set. While I'm sure I'm being unfair I can't get pass the bench chisel's handle.

You can get the Narex bench chisels with the same handle as the firmers. See http://www.narextools.cz/en/bevel-ed...l-premium-8116. I bought a set of 4 on Amazon a while back as a gift for somebody.

[Nathan Johnson]

You can get the Narex bench chisels with the same handle as the firmers. See http://www.narextools.cz/en/bevel-ed...l-premium-8116. I bought a set of 4 on Amazon a while back as a gift for somebody.

This is the set I ordered also, specifically because I thought the handles were so much better looking.
I'm enjoying them so far.

[Patrick Chase]

This is the set I ordered also, specifically because I thought the handles were so much better looking.
I'm enjoying them so far.

FWIW you can find details in Narex's catalog. The short version is that the handles on the ones you have are Hornwood, while the "lower-end" hooped ones are stained Beech.

[Patrick Chase]

One other option for "firmer" chisels are the Hirsch ones that Lee Valley sells. I've put "firmer" in quotes because they're partially bevelled, which some might deem "un-firmer-like".

Robert Sorby still makes a set of registered (flat-sided) firmer chisels IIRC.

[Stewie Simpson]

The term "Registered" Chisel has its roots in the fact that up until modern times, unique handle designs were often "registered" with the British government for copyright protection. The correct term for the Sorby "Registered" chisel is a firmer chisel, or it could be called a heavy firmer. The longer version of these chisels are commonly known as framing chisels since there primary applications is in the timber framing trade.

http://www.thebestthings.com/newtools/sorby_framing.htm

[Mel Fulks]

Oxford dictionary dates firmer to 1823. Anglicized French "formoir", defines as broad thin chisels used to clean up sides of big mortises in such as building framing. DOES NOT say can't be used for other stuff.

[Mel Fulks]

Warren, I doubt you have posted any faulty info. Am surprised if those chisels mentioned in the early books were called "firmer". Do you think the use of "firmer" is a modern editing for clarity ,or indeed precedes the Oxford ED date of 1823 ?
Thanks